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[01:28:19] <mess> ; )
[03:44:53] <pfred1> les hey there
[03:45:07] <les> hi pfred
[03:45:45] <les> was just checking out paltalk
[03:45:54] <pfred1> man i got all my woodworking tools in Delaware and need to get some stuff ready for a show
[03:46:14] <les> I need some low cost video conferenceing
[03:46:14] <pfred1> glad i don't do too many shows anymore :)
[03:46:35] <pfred1> don't most digital cameras do sound and video today?
[03:46:53] <les> pfred I am involved a bit in power tool design now
[03:47:12] <pfred1> hmm there aren't enough power tools already?
[03:47:21] <les> heh yeah
[03:47:37] <pfred1> or just they're not sexy enough to entice more buyers?
[03:47:39] <les> I'm gonna make some more I guess
[03:47:57] <pfred1> 101V cordless amaze your friends!
[03:48:04] <les> heh
[03:48:08] <pfred1> just don't use this product in the rain ...
[03:48:31] <les> anyway I am having some problems with sound caerd
[03:48:43] <les> interference problems
[03:48:44] <pfred1> stick with creative labs
[03:48:55] <pfred1> they seem most compatible
[03:49:08] <les> I want a good video conference system
[03:49:24] <les> cause I don't want to get on planes
[03:49:26] <pfred1> I had sound card problems spent god knows how much time on it finally I said the heck with this $32 later I was in business
[03:49:53] <pfred1> at some time time has to have some value
[03:50:27] <les> I am getting a high pitched sqeal when I record or use things like paltalk
[03:50:37] <pfred1> oh that's feedback
[03:50:41] <pfred1> :)
[03:50:52] <pfred1> move the mic away from the speakers
[03:50:57] <les> no not feedback...
[03:51:04] <pfred1> are you sure?
[03:51:17] <les> it is interference with cdrw I think
[03:51:21] <pfred1> pull up a mixer app fiddle with it
[03:51:25] <les> I am sure
[03:51:34] <les> I fiddled
[03:51:39] <pfred1> hmmm
[03:51:55] <pfred1> I can get wicked feedback when I am capturing the mic here
[03:51:55] <les> it is a software thing
[03:52:13] <pfred1> I pretty much can't monitor at all
[03:52:26] <les> I am using a very expensive pro audio mic and mixer system here
[03:52:34] <les> it's the sound card
[03:52:57] <pfred1> hmm is it onboard or a seperate card?
[03:53:11] <pfred1> can try changing slots if it's a card
[03:53:14] <les> remember my first job out of school was an audio r&d engineer
[03:53:28] <pfred1> yeah don't mean you remember much of it tho :)
[03:53:30] <les> on board cmedia
[03:53:36] <les> on an asus mb
[03:53:39] <pfred1> whelp there goes trying to move it
[03:53:45] <les> yeah
[03:54:00] <pfred1> can disable it and try another card again Irecommend creative labs
[03:54:12] <pfred1> not the best but well they're very common
[03:54:14] <les> I think I need to do that
[03:54:23] <les> I googled the problem
[03:54:28] <pfred1> so they must be working for someone
[03:54:38] <les> common with on board cmedia audio
[03:54:43] <pfred1> really not many really use mics
[03:54:55] <pfred1> yeah onboard sound probably leaves much to be desired
[03:55:16] <pfred1> then agian I wouldn't get no top of the pops just came out yesterday every bell and whistle on it sound card
[03:55:30] <pfred1> that may lead to problems too
[03:55:45] <les> I just want to eveluate paltalk audio and dvd quality video
[03:55:52] <les> again...
[03:56:02] <pfred1> les this is like the best place in the world to buy hardware
http://www.newegg.com/
[03:56:05] <les> because I don't want to go to china
[03:56:17] <pfred1> man new egg is on the money!
[03:56:28] <les> I know of them
[03:56:51] <pfred1> maybe they're not always the cheapest on listed price but they're reasonable when all is said and done
[03:57:26] <pfred1> peace of mind has to be worth something
[03:58:37] <les> people want me to fly places...it's expensive and not fun
[03:58:51] <pfred1> heck can even be dangerious
[03:59:03] <pfred1> run into a high building enroute
[03:59:11] <les> videoconferencing is better
[03:59:13] <pfred1> it's been known to have happened!
[03:59:19] <les> oh I like flying...
[03:59:25] <les> I am a pilot
[03:59:37] <pfred1> yeah as long as people without big beards are on the plane
[03:59:47] <les> heh
[03:59:57] <pfred1> hey you with the boxcutter sit down!
[04:00:25] <pfred1> I haven't tried to fly since then all I hear is long security lines
[04:00:42] <pfred1> not that the security personal are actually going to find anything
[04:00:53] <les> so if I can talk to customers on a near dvd quality audio/video link....
[04:01:02] <les> that seems a good thing
[04:01:27] <pfred1> yeah and you could setup presentations in a controlled environment hopefully too
[04:01:34] <les> yeah
[04:01:48] <pfred1> well I wanted to show you such and such but it's in Tazmania right now or last i heard ...
[04:01:58] <les> I just don't want to fly commercial
[04:02:25] <pfred1> what do you mean you don't like the huge coffe stain on my shirt?
[04:02:32] <les> ha
[04:02:52] <les> I have flown hundreds of thousands of miles
[04:03:01] <les> but it's getting nuts
[04:03:18] <pfred1> well you should start being concerned with the law of averages catching up to you then!
[04:03:22] <les> I always have electronic gizmos with me
[04:03:33] <les> have a beard so get profiled
[04:03:43] <les> end up in the little room
[04:03:47] <les> sick of it
[04:03:47] <pfred1> hey you with the funky electronics and the beard ...
[04:03:59] <pfred1> sit in this room over here
[04:04:06] <les> right
[04:04:38] <pfred1> least you're not east indian are you?
[04:04:47] <pfred1> man you'd still be in that room!
[04:04:56] <les> also...I have a problem with security being nasty
[04:05:05] <les> I don't like it
[04:05:11] <les> and I get pissed
[04:05:17] <pfred1> hey how'd you like to go through life with a below average intelligence?
[04:05:23] <les> and that makes it worse
[04:05:34] <pfred1> and have to deal with people everyday going places when you're not
[04:05:41] <les> heh
[04:06:06] <les> so anyway videoconference
[04:06:12] <pfred1> I bet them people don't evne go anyplace when they're on vacation
[04:06:24] <les> right
[04:06:25] <pfred1> and even if they did it'd be just like being at work!
[04:06:32] <pfred1> oh no we're at an airport!
[04:07:02] <pfred1> yeah it sounds reasonable to me
[04:07:10] <pfred1> don't they make phones today that just do it?
[04:07:17] <pfred1> I thought i saw a commercial on TV
[04:07:45] <les> well I just need to see and talk eye to eye
[04:08:07] <pfred1> show and tell never goes out of style does it?
[04:08:16] <les> like we are typing now but 2 way dvd quality video
[04:08:53] <pfred1> well you'll need a good camera for that
[04:09:09] <les> cheaper than plane tickets
[04:09:11] <pfred1> good camera probably have a godo mic
[04:09:28] <pfred1> good video capture card
[04:09:38] <les> I have good mics...I was an engineer for shure
[04:09:38] <pfred1> good vid cap card have audio in too
[04:09:44] <pfred1> yeah forget them
[04:09:48] <pfred1> camera will have one
[04:10:20] <pfred1> you need to make friends with one of them porno website producers
[04:10:27] <pfred1> that do the streaming live video
[04:10:38] <pfred1> they'd know exactly what you need!
[04:10:48] <les> I don't have a problem spending some money for this
[04:11:13] <pfred1> of course not it's a business expense like you said probably cheaper than roud trip tickets
[04:11:24] <les> yeah
[04:11:28] <pfred1> still it is always good to get what one wants
[04:11:40] <les> since I need to go to china otherwise
[04:11:47] <pfred1> as opposed to figuring things out by the process of elimination
[04:11:53] <pfred1> whelp that didn't work
[04:11:58] <pfred1> next!
[04:12:23] <pfred1> hey if you're in Tianimin square wath out for tanks
[04:12:45] <les> well I will try to figure out my sound hardware problem
[04:12:52] <les> and get this set up
[04:12:57] <pfred1> hmmm
[04:13:05] <pfred1> maybe you need to attack it from the software side?
[04:13:14] <pfred1> then the software will tell yo uwhat hardware you need?
[04:13:36] <les> it's a cmedia sound thing on an asus mb
[04:13:49] <pfred1> yeah but what software do you plan on using?
[04:13:55] <pfred1> netmeeting or something?
[04:14:21] <les> no paltalk
[04:14:33] <les> new thing
[04:14:41] <les> very high quality
[04:14:48] <les> google it
[04:14:56] <pfred1> new things are well enjoy the bleeding edge
[04:15:05] <pfred1> be the first lemming over the cliff so to speak
[04:15:11] <les> yeah
[04:15:40] <pfred1> well I'm sure you know what you're getting yourself into
[04:15:50] <les> I just want to set up a streaming video dvd quality chat room
[04:15:52] <pfred1> but nothing ventured nothing gained
[04:15:59] <les> to talk to customers
[04:16:27] <pfred1> heck there may be more money in setting up videoconferncing systems than designing tools!
[04:16:49] <pfred1> people will be like wow set this up for us
[04:16:51] <les> so I don't have toget on tin cans for 17 hr flights
[04:17:30] <pfred1> yeah that's harsh one way?
[04:18:00] <les> you know, I have flown to europe for a one hour meeting
[04:18:05] <pfred1> they'd better have lots of godo inflight movies for that trip!
[04:18:17] <les> ach
[04:18:25] <pfred1> 17 hours
[04:18:34] <pfred1> heck it just rained here for 2 days
[04:18:35] <les> yeah
[04:18:47] <les> it was nasty here too
[04:18:57] <pfred1> so I know the cabin fever a little but not a plane for better than a half a day
[04:19:24] <les> it's bad
[04:19:34] <pfred1> yeah i cna't imagine how it smells
[04:19:36] <les> I guess I am not a good traveller
[04:19:52] <pfred1> 17 hours couped up with a plane load of people
[04:19:58] <pfred1> it's gotta get funky!
[04:20:03] <les> it does
[04:20:07] <pfred1> eeewwww
[04:20:19] <pfred1> I'd be like open a window!
[04:20:24] <pfred1> dive dive!
[04:20:29] <les> heh
[04:20:49] <les> if they had beds it would be ok
[04:21:10] <pfred1> or just knocked everyone out as they got on the plane
[04:21:26] <pfred1> fill the cabin with nitrous
[04:21:30] <les> I have often thought of that
[04:21:43] <pfred1> it sounds inhumane
[04:21:47] <pfred1> 17 hours!
[04:21:50] <les> knock me out and revive me when we get there
[04:21:55] <pfred1> heh
[04:22:18] <pfred1> and the only way airlines make a profit is to keep shrinking seat size
[04:22:47] <les> 19 inches
[04:23:04] <pfred1> yeah I'm just not that personable for that length of time
[04:23:17] <pfred1> I'd get edgy
[04:23:24] <les> me too
[04:23:28] <pfred1> heck what am i talking about I couldn't go 4 hours
[04:23:37] <les> need meds to make it heh
[04:23:40] <pfred1> hey who's that guy clinging to the ceiling?
[04:23:51] <pfred1> that'd be me
[04:24:21] <les> I have flown on those things enough
[04:24:24] <pfred1> flying makes me a little nervous so I usually get really loaded
[04:24:28] <les> so
[04:24:38] <les> video
[04:24:49] <pfred1> and that's before i even get on the plane!
[04:24:52] <les> Oh flying doesn't bother me
[04:25:01] <les> being a pilot myself
[04:25:18] <pfred1> hey on the way down that ain't gonna help you out one little bit
[04:25:24] <les> haha
[04:25:41] <pfred1> I only flown like from here to Florida
[04:25:55] <les> where are you?
[04:26:05] <pfred1> I take off out of Newark
[04:26:12] <pfred1> so it's like an hour and a half
[04:26:16] <les> oh ok
[04:26:22] <pfred1> heck it's halfway over before i realize we've even left the ground
[04:26:46] <pfred1> I always get a seat over the wing so I can't see anything
[04:27:01] <les> I did the chicago to orlando flight a lot
[04:27:15] <les> kids and folks there
[04:27:30] <pfred1> once coming into west palm beach man the guy must have been a nam vet that was flying
[04:27:45] <pfred1> we came in through this thunderstorm that was not to be believed!
[04:28:00] <pfred1> and he just powered right through it like he was landing in a hot LZ
[04:28:10] <pfred1> I swear the plane got hit by lightning
[04:28:15] <pfred1> he didn't care!
[04:28:24] <les> ATC tells them where they have to go
[04:28:44] <les> I have been in some nasty turbulence
[04:28:48] <pfred1> he dropped onto that runway like we were taking on flak
[04:29:19] <les> bet it was better than my first landings in flight school
[04:29:34] <pfred1> we touched down a little hard
[04:29:42] <pfred1> but it beat the beating we were taking in the air!
[04:29:58] <pfred1> you know what them florida thunderheads can be like
[04:30:12] <les> I have flown in stuff that pulls negative g
[04:30:24] <pfred1> the wings were flapping on that plane like it was a bird I swear!
[04:30:30] <les> yup
[04:30:50] <pfred1> but them things are like tanks i guess it took it no sweat
[04:31:00] <pfred1> was like a 727 or something
[04:31:06] <les> negative g=stuff sticks to the ceiling
[04:31:14] <pfred1> nah we didn't have any of that
[04:31:23] <pfred1> but as i can remember he banked pretty hard at one point
[04:31:25] <les> they can takr 4.4g positive
[04:31:30] <pfred1> and well everyone was pretty pale
[04:31:33] <les> -1.8 negative
[04:31:48] <les> I have done 6
[04:31:53] <les> it hurts
[04:32:07] <les> and zero...
[04:32:08] <pfred1> nah no gees
[04:32:11] <les> feels funy
[04:32:16] <pfred1> just batman and robin angles for a little while
[04:32:41] <pfred1> I guess it's a good thing we idnd't hit any windshear
[04:33:01] <pfred1> come to think of it now it was a little bumpy for a bit
[04:33:10] <les> I fly parabolic trajectories some
[04:33:14] <les> for fun
[04:33:27] <les> zero g for 10 or 20 seconds
[04:33:27] <pfred1> I keep both feet on the ground as much as possible myself
[04:33:44] <pfred1> heck I'm not even too wild about boating
[04:33:46] <les> I do to
[04:33:52] <les> flying is $$$$
[04:34:05] <pfred1> it's just what I'm used ot is all
[04:34:17] <les> yeah
[04:34:20] <pfred1> I never flown that much or boated that much so I'm a fish out of water with both of them
[04:34:39] <pfred1> really I donno which one gets to me more
[04:35:06] <les> well I grew up on the water in florida and am an aerospace engineer....so I can do them some
[04:35:14] <pfred1> I know this one guy Dave we call him Old Salty
[04:35:22] <pfred1> because he's like Mr Boat
[04:35:28] <pfred1> and well he can kinda freak me out
[04:35:51] <pfred1> because he'll go off the coast of Block Island out like 22 miles in a 12 foot boat and think nothng of it
[04:36:01] <pfred1> and I'm like hey Dave ah ...
[04:36:11] <les> I can get seasick
[04:36:12] <pfred1> I haven't seen land now for a while
[04:36:19] <les> never on a plane though
[04:36:26] <pfred1> yeah
[04:36:32] <pfred1> it's worse below deck too
[04:36:37] <les> yes
[04:36:46] <les> need to see the horizon
[04:36:48] <pfred1> he's got a sailboat too
[04:36:59] <pfred1> he's a nut
[04:37:24] <pfred1> he bought that boat it'd been on fire i think
[04:37:32] <pfred1> so it took him like 3 years to fix it all up
[04:37:37] <les> I got sick flying only once
[04:37:46] <les> but not motion sickness
[04:37:54] <pfred1> just had like a cold?
[04:37:58] <les> I came down with a sudden flu
[04:38:01] <pfred1> yeah
[04:38:07] <pfred1> were i na weakened state
[04:38:29] <les> I have had passengers that got motion sick though
[04:38:36] <les> It's not fun
[04:38:49] <pfred1> hey at least you had gravity
[04:39:00] <pfred1> them poor astronauts
[04:39:19] <pfred1> you read anything about the MIR?
[04:39:26] <pfred1> man that place was disgusting!
[04:39:31] <les> well I know about zero g since we do it with the parabolic flights
[04:39:44] <les> it feels weird
[04:39:54] <pfred1> I've been on rollercoasters
[04:39:58] <les> dirt floats up from the floor
[04:40:05] <pfred1> bout as close as I've come to it I guess
[04:40:14] <les> close enough
[04:40:23] <pfred1> that's what i say!
[04:40:45] <pfred1> yeah I always knew i never wanted to be an astronaut
[04:41:04] <les> you know the "vomit comet" flights NASA does
[04:41:05] <pfred1> * pfred1 likes gravity!
[04:41:14] <pfred1> yeah the plane that dives
[04:41:23] <les> parabolic
[04:41:33] <les> that is what I have done
[04:41:35] <pfred1> well whatever it does
[04:41:58] <pfred1> nah gravity is my friend
[04:42:08] <pfred1> I count on it
[04:42:08] <les> we tried to eat m&ms floating around
[04:42:59] <les> then most folks puke
[04:43:04] <pfred1> I remember I was in Florida once for a long time then i came back here and my friends took me out the nite i came back
[04:43:17] <les> so m&ms float around some more
[04:43:19] <pfred1> and i just about got seasick on the roads here
[04:43:29] <pfred1> it's so flat most places!
[04:43:45] <les> yeah fl is flat
[04:43:59] <les> where iam it ids not flat
[04:44:02] <pfred1> yeah one nite my buddies there they took me on this drive like 40 minutes
[04:44:13] <pfred1> then we went ove this little whoop in the road
[04:44:20] <pfred1> they were all excited about it
[04:44:24] <les> heh
[04:44:24] <pfred1> I was like are you kidding?
[04:44:47] <pfred1> I've seen roads with worse crowns than that man!
[04:45:01] <pfred1> yeah i guess they were flatlanders
[04:45:13] <pfred1> I live in a place called Summit so you can imagine
[04:45:18] <les> well I grew up in fl
[04:45:22] <pfred1> it's basically all hills here
[04:45:37] <les> 20 years in chicago..alsoflat
[04:45:46] <pfred1> I mean we got roads here you can launch a car
[04:45:53] <les> but here 200 to 6600 ft
[04:45:59] <les> 2000
[04:46:00] <pfred1> actually get the whole thing airborne
[04:46:19] <les> we have 9% grades here
[04:46:24] <pfred1> there's places i know where there's scars in the road from frames scraping
[04:46:33] <les> heh
[04:46:45] <pfred1> yeah when yo usee frame scars you know it's bad
[04:46:58] <les> yup
[04:47:05] <pfred1> but that nite I got seasick driving around here
[04:47:14] <pfred1> well getting driven around
[04:47:25] <pfred1> the next day i was OK tho
[04:47:32] <pfred1> but it was weird
[04:47:45] <les> if you are the driver you don't get sick
[04:47:56] <pfred1> probably that's what i was just thinking
[04:48:10] <pfred1> but still if people from other places come here to drive
[04:48:16] <pfred1> it's got to be something else for most people
[04:48:42] <pfred1> our roads heck most of them were laid out before the revolutionary war
[04:48:45] <pfred1> so
[04:48:55] <les> I have gotten sick driving on the windey roads here
[04:49:01] <les> which is funny
[04:49:06] <pfred1> rapid transit was the last thing on their minds
[04:49:18] <les> spins in an aircraft do not bother me
[04:49:31] <pfred1> that's what i'm saying driving here can be like flying
[04:49:41] <pfred1> up and down up and down around and up and down
[04:49:55] <les> yeah
[04:50:11] <pfred1> bicycling is fun here
[04:50:17] <les> regular stuff makes you sick
[04:50:17] <pfred1> cept for the people driving
[04:50:34] <pfred1> there's one road here I swear I can hit over 60
[04:50:43] <pfred1> it's such a steep and long hill
[04:50:55] <pfred1> well on a regular 10 speed not the bike i have now
[04:51:08] <pfred1> your wheels would gyro
[04:51:08] <les> reminds me...need new tires on the bike
[04:51:14] <pfred1> Malmart
[04:51:19] <pfred1> Walmart even
[04:51:25] <pfred1> they cheap for bike tires
[04:51:33] <pfred1> I just bought some for my garden cart there
[04:51:53] <pfred1> I needed cables for my bike
[04:52:03] <pfred1> so I go to this bike store get one bare cable for like $4.50
[04:52:18] <pfred1> then I'm in Walmart I get a whole kit sleeves cables everythign for $3.00
[04:52:23] <pfred1> and it was a name brand
[04:52:39] <les> I will have to check that out
[04:52:39] <pfred1> you cannot beat Walmart!
[04:52:46] <pfred1> and they do stock bike parts
[04:53:08] <pfred1> yeah i got the bike i have now at the town dumps
[04:53:19] <pfred1> some oke chucked it out because the chain rusted on it
[04:53:27] <pfred1> it's a Trek liek a $400 bike
[04:53:43] <pfred1> I was like I'll take this!
[04:53:44] <les> well...better hit the sack eh?
[04:53:57] <les> have to do some work in the morning
[04:53:59] <pfred1> yeah godo chatting good luck with vid conferencing
[04:54:10] <les> thanks
[04:54:11] <pfred1> call the company
[04:54:18] <les> back on in the morning
[04:54:19] <pfred1> they tell you what you need
[04:54:38] <pfred1> that's what I'd do
[04:54:41] <pfred1> play dumb
[04:54:48] <les> sounds like a plan
[04:54:55] <les> nite pfred
[04:54:57] <pfred1> nite
[07:14:07] <anonimasu> * anonimasu stretches
[07:14:09] <anonimasu> morning people
[07:15:37] <Jymmm> howdy
[07:16:02] <anonimasu> what's up?
[07:16:20] <Jymmm> getting ready to hit the bed =)
[07:16:55] <anonimasu> ok
[07:17:17] <Jymmm> also trying to decide what size to mak ethis router
[07:17:30] <Jymmm> I'm thinkin 18" x 24" x 6"
[07:18:34] <Jymmm> what ya think?
[07:18:55] <anonimasu> hm it sounds "tiny" but you were limited in space right?
[07:19:40] <Jymmm> I could make it bigger, but this is the size I'm thinking about selling initially. I'll probably make my personal machine 24" x 36"
[07:19:53] <anonimasu> ah that's better
[07:20:09] <anonimasu> I find my mill table a bit small.. for some stuff..
[07:20:22] <anonimasu> specially when facemilling
[07:20:30] <Jymmm> well, what you think abotu 24" x 26" for selling?
[07:20:37] <Jymmm> 36"
[07:21:08] <Jymmm> 24x36
[07:21:12] <anonimasu> nice
[07:21:25] <anonimasu> but I think you will have a hard time selling it :)
[07:21:34] <anonimasu> once you start making chips it's addictive ;)
[07:21:34] <Jymmm> why's that?
[07:21:53] <Jymmm> ah, heh
[07:22:10] <Jymmm> nah, just use it to make another
[07:22:51] <anonimasu> ah yeah then it's easeir
[07:23:23] <Jymmm> Yep, then get a few sold and design something in aluminum (maybe)
[07:24:08] <anonimasu> yeah
[07:24:09] <anonimasu> :)
[07:24:15] <anonimasu> what are you going to cut with it?
[07:24:29] <anonimasu> wood/alu/steel
[07:24:30] <anonimasu> ?
[07:24:31] <Jymmm> wood, aluminum,
[07:24:38] <Jymmm> maybe glass
[07:25:02] <anonimasu> ok, non ferrous stuff :)
[07:25:11] <anonimasu> I am very tempted to try building a router
[07:25:22] <anonimasu> with a vital card and some servos..
[07:25:37] <Jymmm> never heard of vital
[07:25:38] <anonimasu> I am amazed at www.datrondynamics.com
[07:25:51] <anonimasu> it's a card like stg for running servos
[07:26:15] <Jymmm> ah,ok
[07:26:59] <anonimasu> 250mm/s in alu is cool ;)
[07:29:20] <Jymmm> I bet
[07:30:09] <anonimasu> check the video on their page..
[07:30:21] <anonimasu> I think that's slower but it's still damn fast
[07:38:27] <Jymmm> Will check it out tomorrow.. calling ti a night!
[08:56:50] <anonimasu> hello alex
[09:06:16] <A-L-P-H-A> morning folks.
[09:10:47] <A-L-P-H-A> I've got a way to convert a BMP/PNG/GIf/JPG to gcode? I've got a drawing I want to mill out. it's a pattern for a coin.
[09:11:21] <A-L-P-H-A> a 2" coin...
[09:14:24] <alex_joni> hey guys
[09:14:34] <alex_joni> alpha: doing nasty stuff? :D
[09:14:55] <alex_joni> anyways.. there's some image to gcode converters out there
[09:15:16] <alex_joni> I remember someone from here doing that (with a laser), can't seem to recall who it was thou
[09:17:04] <A-L-P-H-A> no. simple stuff
[09:17:07] <A-L-P-H-A> let me upload it to my gallery
[09:17:44] <alex_joni> http://www.imagetogcode.com/
[09:20:06] <A-L-P-H-A> alex_joni, thank... stupid ftp isn't working
[09:20:13] <alex_joni> np
[09:20:18] <alex_joni> there are a few out there
[09:20:21] <alex_joni> google it up
[09:20:58] <A-L-P-H-A> http://lloydleung.com/gallery/coin_design/#
[09:21:00] <A-L-P-H-A> there we go
[09:21:47] <alex_joni> wouldn't it be easier to do that in cad?
[09:21:50] <A-L-P-H-A> http://lloydleung.com/gallery/coin_design/Coin_Design.png that's what I want to mill... with the circle being the actual coin dimension is 2".
[09:21:57] <A-L-P-H-A> alex_joni, it was drawn in cad. but with TTF fonts.
[09:21:58] <alex_joni> acad-> dxf -> ace
[09:22:08] <A-L-P-H-A> acad ttf -> dxf -> nothing
[09:22:14] <alex_joni> how come?
[09:22:16] <A-L-P-H-A> let me try
[09:25:01] <A-L-P-H-A> yup
[09:25:07] <A-L-P-H-A> it doesn't work with ttf fonts.
[09:25:14] <alex_joni> convert them to curves first
[09:25:32] <A-L-P-H-A> how do I convert the ttf to vectors within acad?
[09:26:18] <A-L-P-H-A> ahhh!!!
[09:26:28] <A-L-P-H-A> I can explode it.
[09:27:32] <A-L-P-H-A> I can explode the word dealer, but not the other text.
[09:27:33] <A-L-P-H-A> damn it!
[09:47:05] <anonimasu> * anonimasu yawns
[09:47:15] <alex_joni> * alex_joni agrees
[09:47:56] <anonimasu> A-L-P-H-A: bmp->gcode
[09:48:31] <anonimasu> gnu cnc utilities has a program like that
[09:48:32] <anonimasu> I think
[09:48:38] <anonimasu> I think they were named like that
[09:50:12] <A-L-P-H-A> 'ight... I'll check that out.
[09:50:45] <anonimasu> if you cant find them tell me and I'll look for the url
[10:04:56] <alex_joni> greetings paul_c
[10:05:14] <paul_c> Morning Alex
[10:07:47] <alex_joni> what's up?
[10:10:55] <paul_c> Was thinking about running some tests on a 60m^3 virtual machine.
[10:11:21] <alex_joni> heh
[10:11:49] <alex_joni> the one that's doing 50m/min ?
[10:12:26] <anonimasu> :D
[10:12:52] <paul_c> yup - Want to get the accel up to 1G or higher.
[10:12:56] <alex_joni> coo
[10:13:17] <anonimasu> nice!
[10:13:45] <anonimasu> 833mm/s
[10:13:46] <anonimasu> heh
[10:13:51] <alex_joni> I imagine riding that =))
[10:14:41] <anonimasu> the machine+
[10:14:41] <anonimasu> heh
[10:14:52] <anonimasu> I'd be scared of the chips.
[10:15:15] <anonimasu> or rather, not chips.. pices that comes flying
[10:16:10] <alex_joni> I gotta run
[10:16:13] <alex_joni> laters guys
[10:24:21] <A-L-P-H-A> I'm almost going to give up on this endeaver.
[10:24:46] <anonimasu> :/
[10:32:17] <A-L-P-H-A> do it manually now! argh
[10:32:43] <A-L-P-H-A> type the text on a straight line, draw an arc, divide that arc by # of characters... place and rotate
[11:27:36] <anonimasu> iab
[11:43:22] <A-L-P-H-A> I fucking hate autocad.
[11:43:28] <A-L-P-H-A> it just lost 30 minutes of work.
[11:45:26] <anonimasu> I hate it too
[11:45:27] <anonimasu> :)
[11:56:14] <cradek> I have R12 for DOS and think it's great - have they made it suck since then?
[11:56:59] <A-L-P-H-A> I've used r10, r11, r12, r14. 2000, 2002, 2004. Been using for years... just that it crashed for no appearant reason. and I didn't save for a little bit.
[11:57:07] <A-L-P-H-A> ctrl-s is my friend.
[11:57:37] <cradek> do you have autosave disabled?
[11:57:42] <cradek> or don't they have it anymore?
[11:58:25] <A-L-P-H-A> they have it... but when working with large files, it lags the system too much.
[11:58:30] <A-L-P-H-A> so after any major changes, I usually save.
[11:58:37] <A-L-P-H-A> but I was a little engrossed... and forgot
[11:59:19] <cradek> that sucks
[12:00:35] <jepler_> I guess on windows you can't autosave in the obvious, non-laggy way: fork() the program, then in the child save and exit.
[12:01:58] <A-L-P-H-A> still lags.
[12:02:13] <A-L-P-H-A> and if you fork, fine... what happens if you're in the middle of an edit? or change? you'll have mangled files.
[12:02:36] <cradek> so don't do it then
[12:04:24] <jepler_> you'd fork when you dropped back into the main event loop and the drawing was in a consistent state
[12:04:37] <jepler_> you'll also have to do something clever if the user hits "save" in the parent while the child is running.
[12:06:17] <A-L-P-H-A> jepler_, I'm not developing autocad... autodesk is. :) Tell them. heh.
[12:13:33] <A-L-P-H-A> well... my code works.
[12:13:49] <A-L-P-H-A> just need to see if I have an smallish ballend mill.
[12:17:37] <A-L-P-H-A> horray! :) found a bunch of 1/16 endmills.
[12:32:33] <A-L-P-H-A> hmm... if I had some 1mm end mills.
[12:42:43] <A-L-P-H-A> hey SWPadnos.
[12:45:27] <SWPadnos_> SWPadnos_ is now known as SWPadnos
[13:01:15] <alex_joni> * alex_joni is back
[13:02:08] <paul_c> * paul_c finishes a test run with loads of short Z moves.
[13:02:24] <alex_joni> how's the 50m3 machine?
[13:02:28] <alex_joni> running fine?
[13:03:16] <paul_c> This run was with a 300mm^3 machine
[13:03:30] <alex_joni> coo
[13:03:57] <paul_c> 0.027m^3
[13:04:06] <alex_joni> heh
[13:04:22] <paul_c> 300mm on X, Y, & Z
[13:04:25] <alex_joni> I was thinking of starting with CL & NML
[13:04:45] <alex_joni> are there any issues I should be aware of before I start?
[13:04:57] <paul_c> beat you to it...
[13:05:24] <alex_joni> really?
[13:05:35] <alex_joni> can I help?
[13:06:20] <paul_c> Some of the issues... CL uses Gtk Ver. 1.2
[13:06:43] <alex_joni> and it should work on 2.0 ?
[13:06:52] <paul_c> needs work.
[13:07:07] <alex_joni> right
[13:07:12] <paul_c> * paul_c has it compiling with 2.0
[13:07:29] <alex_joni> I was wondering.. what messages did you use from (but especially to) emc
[13:08:31] <paul_c> I was going to get the RT code to compile on a BDI-4 box next.... But,
[13:09:54] <alex_joni> CL doesn't compile on 2.6 .. right?
[13:12:25] <paul_c> there is no reason why it won't compile on a 2.6 kernel - Once the makefile has been hacked.
[13:12:33] <alex_joni> right
[13:13:19] <paul_c> The more I think about PLC functions....
[13:13:53] <paul_c> I see a need for the PLC subsystem to be able to command motion on one or more axis.
[13:14:05] <alex_joni> right
[13:14:18] <alex_joni> even if it's another axis
[13:14:31] <alex_joni> but the emc-axeses too
[13:14:58] <paul_c> yup...
[13:15:05] <alex_joni> I wonder: what if you'd have an axis controlled by emc, but not by the interp ?
[13:15:26] <alex_joni> that would work with hal, not so sure on emc1
[13:15:38] <paul_c> The interp piles motion commands on to a stack
[13:15:52] <alex_joni> yeah.. but imagine it like this
[13:16:00] <alex_joni> the machine is XYZ (for example)
[13:16:17] <alex_joni> but it also has another axis (say T for toolchanger)
[13:16:27] <paul_c> the PLC motion commands either need to be inserted at random points on to this stack, or a separate stack is required.
[13:16:29] <alex_joni> axis T would need commands from the PLC, not from the interp
[13:17:08] <paul_c> To claim that HAL will solve this problem is flawed
[13:17:27] <alex_joni> didn't say that HAL would solve this problem
[13:17:51] <alex_joni> I said I imagine it "might" be doable with HAL (but you'll need to send commands directly to HAL)
[13:17:59] <alex_joni> that wouldn't be a very clean way
[13:19:16] <paul_c> HAL = Hardware Abstraction Layer... HAL != Do anything glue
[13:19:31] <alex_joni> glue?
[13:20:04] <paul_c> HAL is NOT a communication or control library.
[13:20:25] <alex_joni> I agree on that
[13:20:51] <alex_joni> but it's a hook from where motion can be commanded (I'm not saying that it would be ok to do it like that, only that it's possible)
[13:21:50] <alex_joni> * alex_joni will be right back (15 mins.)
[13:21:55] <alex_joni> alex_joni is now known as alex_joni_away
[13:23:49] <nevyn_> nevyn_ is now known as nevyn
[14:00:52] <alex_joni_away> alex_joni_away is now known as alex_joni
[14:00:55] <alex_joni> * alex_joni is back
[14:01:03] <SWPadnos> woohoo - party!
[14:01:10] <alex_joni> hey Stephen
[14:01:26] <SWPadnos> hiya
[14:01:39] <alex_joni> what's cookin'?
[14:02:00] <SWPadnos> very little at the moment
[14:02:06] <SWPadnos> I should probably get to work :)
[14:02:12] <alex_joni> bugger that
[14:02:20] <SWPadnos> yeah - that's what I say
[14:02:28] <SWPadnos> (or I would, if I were in England)
[14:02:37] <alex_joni> lol.. yeah
[14:02:49] <alex_joni> how do you say that in the US?
[14:02:57] <SWPadnos> screw that
[14:03:04] <SWPadnos> (or more forcefully ... )
[14:03:06] <alex_joni> right ;)
[14:31:42] <alex_joni> hello Dmess
[14:38:27] <paul_c> Hi Ray
[14:38:40] <alex_joni> hey Ray
[14:38:56] <SWPadnos> Hi Ray
[14:39:13] <paul_c> 42250mm/Sec would appear to be the limit...
[14:39:32] <paul_c> 42250mm/min would appear to be the limit...
[14:39:32] <rayh> Hi guys.
[14:40:30] <Dmess> allo alex eh all..
[14:41:48] <SWPadnos> Howdy
[14:41:52] <Dmess> nice big linear motors would take 40000mm/min
[14:41:57] <alex_joni> paul_c: 42m/sec would be smthg
[14:42:10] <SWPadnos> Smoking, I'd say
[14:42:19] <alex_joni> but 42m/min is pretty awesome too
[14:42:21] <Dmess> try and STOP it
[14:42:34] <SWPadnos> Carbon Fiber - easy to stop :)
[14:42:35] <alex_joni> Dmess: ESTOP should halt it instantly
[14:44:05] <paul_c> It does - And it makes a nasty BANG !
[14:44:05] <alex_joni> I've got some big gantrys on my robots (doing up to 1-1,5m/sec in rapids)
[14:44:05] <Dmess> youve never seen a 50 ft boring mill with a runaway axis your trying to troubleshoot..
[14:44:05] <alex_joni> they really stop at ESTOP
[14:44:15] <Dmess> yes the STOP... hurt tech's too...puckerfactor goes up
[14:44:36] <alex_joni> right
[14:44:50] <SWPadnos_> SWPadnos_ is now known as SWPadnos
[14:45:39] <Dmess> some of the early linear motors were normally open and @ power failure the just went dead...
[14:46:09] <Dmess> lathes were dropping turrets int tailstockes for a month or two at DMG
[14:46:18] <alex_joni> heh
[14:47:16] <alex_joni> on our robots the brakes are on when no power is applied
[14:48:20] <Dmess> but those arent linear motors...
[14:48:32] <alex_joni> nope
[14:48:37] <alex_joni> AC's
[14:48:58] <Dmess> with a brake on the back??
[14:49:04] <alex_joni> on the front
[14:49:10] <Dmess> whereever
[14:49:10] <alex_joni> on the back there's a resolver
[14:49:32] <Dmess> ive seen back have brake then resolver or encoder
[14:50:28] <Dmess> Hermle put the brake on the top of the leadscrew on one little universal cnc i worked on
[14:57:07] <rayh> paul_c: can you explain a bit about realtimeio.o?
[15:02:35] <paul_c> I was looking at ways of passing data to/from the h/w driver
[15:03:18] <paul_c> that didn't rely on the realtime interface.
[15:04:21] <rayh> * rayh brb phone
[15:08:29] <alex_joni> paul_c: may I file a bugreport?
[15:08:51] <paul_c> on what ?
[15:08:56] <alex_joni> dunno
[15:09:11] <alex_joni> I was just wondering.. the makefile says: Do NOT file a bug report. :)
[15:09:47] <alex_joni> emc2(bdi-4)/src/Makefile
[15:09:51] <paul_c> * paul_c points to the "*** Warning. Unresolved symbols" message from make
[15:10:17] <alex_joni> Ignore any \" *** Warning:\" messages and continue to the next stage.
[15:10:22] <alex_joni> ;)
[15:11:10] <paul_c> You can't file a bug report until you have a bug fix...
[15:11:27] <alex_joni> ok.. so first I'll commit a bug
[15:11:29] <paul_c> and if you have a bug fix, you have write access to CVS...
[15:11:32] <alex_joni> then a bug fix
[15:11:36] <alex_joni> then a bug report
[15:11:38] <alex_joni> ok?
[15:11:38] <alex_joni> :D
[15:11:53] <SWPadnos> paul_c: may I slap alex_joni?
[15:11:55] <alex_joni> just to keep myself busy
[15:11:55] <paul_c> Once a bug fix has been committed
[15:11:58] <SWPadnos> :D
[15:12:03] <paul_c> No need to file a bug report !
[15:12:22] <alex_joni> paul_c: to krank the bug-fixes statistics up
[15:12:24] <paul_c> * paul_c passes SWPadnos a large wet kipper
[15:12:24] <alex_joni> LOL
[15:12:34] <alex_joni> * alex_joni needs a break
[15:12:34] <SWPadnos> *slap*
[15:12:40] <Dmess> hmmm sounds like athe american juducial system... at work..
[15:12:49] <alex_joni> * alex_joni is rolling on the floor
[15:12:49] <SWPadnos> no - too quick and fair
[15:13:04] <alex_joni> right.. going back to work
[15:13:13] <alex_joni> * alex_joni is translating some yucky text
[15:13:23] <SWPadnos> kipper juice?
[15:13:34] <alex_joni> paints & such
[15:14:18] <alex_joni> polyurethan waterbased primers
[15:14:51] <SWPadnos> on the text, or in the text? :)
[15:15:01] <alex_joni> that's what the text is about :D
[15:15:13] <SWPadnos> ah - much easier that way
[15:15:28] <SWPadnos> don't most chemical names remain more or less the same?
[15:16:03] <alex_joni> yeah .. kinda
[15:16:17] <alex_joni> but the definition of a primer definately doesn't
[15:16:27] <SWPadnos> true enough
[15:16:57] <alex_joni> and I only got about 90 pages to go :(
[15:16:59] <Dmess> Dmess hates translatin... did some layerese at one pt
[15:17:12] <alex_joni> layerese?
[15:17:59] <Dmess> legal contracts... whereto ..ih therfore art worthwith... crap..
[15:18:12] <alex_joni> yeah
[15:23:19] <rayh> paul_c: I see that realtimeio.o is built in BDI, how does one go about doing testing of it?
[15:23:29] <alex_joni> cat /dev/emc :D
[15:24:20] <paul_c> At the moment, the tests are hard coded in the source code.
[15:24:29] <rayh> didn't find that dev. Is it only built for emc2 not bdi
[15:24:48] <alex_joni> don't think so
[15:26:10] <paul_c> It is "work in progress" and not fully functional.
[15:26:34] <alex_joni> but it's got nothing to do with emc2
[15:26:43] <alex_joni> for now at least
[15:26:57] <paul_c> More "Proof of Concept" rather than anything really usable at the moment.
[15:26:59] <alex_joni> does /proc/emc work?
[15:27:13] <paul_c> Yes.
[15:28:09] <alex_joni> jee.. epoxyester :)
[15:28:19] <alex_joni> sounds like a mad easter bunny :D
[15:30:05] <rayh> Yep cat /proc/emc/status shows changes to heartbeat and estop
[15:30:42] <paul_c> /proc/emc was added more as a quick'n'easy debugging aid.
[15:30:56] <alex_joni> paul_c: can I try the CL stuff you did?
[15:31:07] <SWPadnos> are you planning on expandin /proc/emc/status, or dropping it (or something in between)?
[15:31:55] <paul_c> plan on expanding /proc/emc to cover a load of other things.
[15:32:17] <SWPadnos> ok. note that there's a 4k (single page) limit on the simple /proc interface
[15:32:44] <alex_joni> SWP: but surely you can register more?
[15:33:03] <alex_joni> like /proc/emc/status /proc/emc/estop /proc/emc/io etc.
[15:33:04] <SWPadnos> yep - you can create larger buffers on your own
[15:33:12] <SWPadnos> right - that too :)
[15:33:35] <paul_c> 4K is still quite a bit of data.
[15:33:40] <SWPadnos> yes
[15:34:03] <paul_c> the only limitation is no floating point numbers
[15:34:03] <SWPadnos> but in "human readable" terms, it can run out pretty quickly
[15:34:07] <SWPadnos> true
[15:35:04] <SWPadnos> there's a pretty small range of floats though, right?
[15:35:17] <SWPadnos> (like +- 10000.000 or so)
[15:36:05] <paul_c> It is not the range that is the problem...
[15:36:31] <SWPadnos> no, but a small range can be easily converted in to a 32-bit fixed point int
[15:36:44] <SWPadnos> which can then be printed using the kernel print routines
[15:36:58] <SWPadnos> (or a slightly customized print routine)
[15:37:31] <paul_c> 'cept it is unwise to use any floating point math (including conversions) in kernel space.
[15:37:59] <paul_c> The proc handler is outside the realtime code
[15:38:04] <SWPadnos> right - the emc code would have to duplicate float values into separate "printable" vars
[15:38:15] <SWPadnos> which would suck, but would work
[15:38:19] <rayh> No matter what debug level I set in an ini, the cat shows the same 0x0.
[15:39:06] <paul_c> the debug level in the ini is not used in the RT code.
[15:39:28] <rayh> Ah. And this proc looks at the rt.
[15:39:58] <paul_c> yup
[15:40:04] <alex_joni> rayh: how do you like the splash I did for emc2?
[15:41:06] <rayh> I've not run emc2 in a while.
[15:41:22] <alex_joni> it's not in CVS yet
[15:41:25] <alex_joni> http://www.robcon.ro/emc/splash-emc2-v3.jpg
[15:41:40] <Dmess> alex... the text in the clouds probably shouldn't be a bunch of errors..
[15:41:58] <alex_joni> Dmess: it ain't ;)
[15:42:03] <alex_joni> it's a bunch of code
[15:43:06] <rayh> * rayh is seeing it dribble in.
[15:43:07] <Dmess> oh sorry... was one very similar i seen yesterday
[15:45:50] <rayh> awesome!
[15:46:20] <alex_joni> glad you like it
[15:50:06] <rayh> There was a aviator penguin on the cover of infoworld a few weeks ago.
[15:55:24] <jepler_> jepler_ is now known as jepler
[15:56:17] <asdfqwega> asdfqwega is now known as H-A-R-D-2-T-Y-P-
[15:56:36] <H-A-R-D-2-T-Y-P-> H-A-R-D-2-T-Y-P- is now known as asdfqwega
[16:04:57] <asdfqwega> Grrr...I *hate* large, secure webpages...they never finish loading
[16:06:02] <paul_c> * paul_c hates encrypted PDF files
[16:06:24] <alex_joni> encrypted ? :)
[16:06:50] <asdfqwega> * asdfqwega hates websites with audio, too
[16:09:20] <alex_joni> well.. I hate to stay so long at work
[16:09:25] <alex_joni> so I'll go home now
[16:09:26] <alex_joni> bye
[16:09:27] <alex_joni> ;)
[16:09:28] <asdfqwega> The page I'm after *really* sucks...it has included in it a selection menu for probably every country and city on Earth.
[16:10:11] <asdfqwega> Home is the nice warm place where your brain lives, I say
[16:10:36] <Dmess> home is where your heart lives...
[16:11:06] <asdfqwega> Where that is, varies from person to person ;)
[16:11:39] <Dmess> my address hasnt been my home for a long time..
[16:12:52] <asdfqwega> Finish this saying: A man's home is his...
[16:13:21] <asdfqwega> They used to say castle, but I think garage is more truthful.
[16:13:31] <Dmess> workshop
[16:14:40] <Dmess> next move i told the wife...i wanted a workshop.. with a house of somekind attatched..
[16:19:46] <asdfqwega> I'd need a library attached to my workshop
[16:20:05] <asdfqwega> Gasp! and Surprise!
[16:20:07] <asdfqwega> It loaded!
[16:22:22] <asdfqwega> Hm
[16:22:31] <asdfqwega> Now where in the world do I come up with a 'digital signature'?
[16:22:51] <asdfqwega> ...and I don't even have a Wacom tablet!
[16:23:00] <cradek> RTFM gpg
[16:30:31] <asdfqwega> Hm...I don't think that's it. They only have a short entry box, and gpg outputs a couple lines for a sign
[16:31:03] <asdfqwega> AND it seems unlikely, considering where it is
[16:32:06] <asdfqwega> or maybe I'm wrong.
[16:36:43] <jepler> asdfqwega: is this for sourceforge? You want to use ssh-keygen, then paste the contents of the "whatever.pub" public key file
[16:38:49] <asdfqwega> No, this is for submitting a resume to a company
[16:40:04] <asdfqwega> Grr...I'm going to shoot a web-designer when I get through with this
[16:41:07] <Dmess> been waiting 4 wks for an MSI Mobo on warrenty.. the board is discontiued.. so i cant even find a replacement
[16:43:40] <paul_c> * paul_c downloads a few more CNC programming manuals....
[16:45:53] <Dmess> paul... i have some i can post FOR YOU
[16:46:10] <paul_c> To England ?
[16:47:29] <Dmess> cd's dont cost a mint to ship... or i can post to homepage.. i think... from this box..??
[16:48:17] <Dmess> did you get the siemens link last week??
[16:48:40] <paul_c> Yes thanks... Downloaded the whole site.
[16:49:01] <Dmess> www3.ad.siemens.de/doconweb/
[16:49:38] <paul_c> and also Boosch
[16:50:09] <Dmess> the 840D is a beast of a box... i wish EMC2 took a look at some of their features..
[16:50:46] <Dmess> the 5 -axis stuff gets SOOOO easy.. even programming AT the control..
[16:51:28] <paul_c> Time for Tea.
[16:55:50] <Imperator_> hm, siemens and easy is something totaly different
[16:56:27] <Imperator_> Heidenhain controllers are much more user friendly
[16:59:18] <Dmess> Imp... i agree.. but if your a programmer to start with Siemens gives you total control... Heidie... says sure ... do it MY way or the highway...
[17:00:15] <Dmess> an in 5 axis heidenhain MillPlus is almost as good but it isnt a TNC...
[17:01:13] <Dmess> g17 p100 q200 l3.... repeat lines n100-1200 3 times
[17:01:35] <Dmess> n200
[17:04:55] <Imperator__> Imperator__ is now known as Imperator_
[17:12:50] <Imperator_> TNC is Heidenhain :-)
[17:13:04] <Imperator_> you have Shopmill in your Siemens ???
[18:25:09] <pemmet> hey, on a computer, there's those little power cables... yellow, black, black, and red
[18:25:25] <pemmet> as is my understanding, yellow is 12V blacks are ground, and red is 5V
[18:25:53] <paul_c> yup
[18:25:58] <pemmet> now when i put the multimeter up to each contact, i get nothing... and the computer is on...
[18:26:05] <pemmet> i have it set to V DC
[18:26:29] <pemmet> 'cause i wanna pull power for my buffer from the computer... such a nice convenient source of 5 V
[18:26:30] <pemmet> BUT
[18:26:36] <pemmet> i can't seem to get it on the multimeter
[18:26:41] <pemmet> to register as such..
[18:27:09] <SWPadnos> are the meter probes plugged into the correct sockets?
[18:27:18] <SWPadnos> (often V and A are different connections)
[18:27:27] <pemmet> hmm.. it's got 4 ports
[18:27:31] <pemmet> one says 300ma
[18:27:35] <pemmet> another says 10A
[18:27:40] <SWPadnos> use the other one
[18:27:51] <pemmet> and one says V :ohm: and an arrow into a line >
[18:27:57] <SWPadnos> that's the one
[18:27:57] <pemmet> ->|
[18:28:00] <pemmet> ya
[18:28:05] <pemmet> that's what I have the thign pulgged into
[18:28:21] <pemmet> there's also a COM port
[18:28:51] <SWPadnos> are you measuring a cable that comes directly from the PS, or is it a fan connector (ie, is it plugged in)?
[18:29:06] <pemmet> well it's an extra line coming from the power supply
[18:29:13] <pemmet> not plugged into anything at the moment...
[18:29:20] <SWPadnos> OK, but direct from the supply.
[18:29:23] <pemmet> yea
[18:29:39] <SWPadnos> Can you measure the voltage of a battery or something to test the meter?
[18:29:54] <pemmet> good thought.. lemmie find something
[18:30:46] <pemmet> hmm... lemmie try the other probe cable...
[18:31:24] <SWPadnos> you can also put the meter into ohms or continuity mode, and make sure you read 0
[18:31:28] <pemmet> no, still nothing..
[18:31:31] <pemmet> it might be the voltmeter
[18:31:34] <pemmet> ahh
[18:31:35] <pemmet> ok
[18:31:57] <SWPadnos> and if it's been a while since the meter was used, replace the battery in teh meter.
[18:32:23] <pemmet> ok.. i get nothing from the computer, but if i touch the probe to the 300mA port, i read about 7.3 ohms
[18:32:51] <SWPadnos> touch the two probes together, and you should get something around 1 ohm or so
[18:33:12] <pemmet> on the 10A line, i get about 21
[18:33:16] <pemmet> not 21
[18:33:18] <pemmet> 1
[18:33:27] <SWPadnos> no - from COM to the V/ohm connection
[18:33:49] <pemmet> 1.4
[18:33:53] <pemmet> to the com
[18:34:00] <anonimasu> hello
[18:34:12] <pemmet> hi
[18:34:15] <SWPadnos> OK - that's with the two probe leads plugged in?
[18:34:40] <pemmet> ya
[18:34:52] <SWPadnos> (ie, connect the meter as though you were going to measure the computer voltages, but then switch the meter to ohms, and connect the two probes together)
[18:35:40] <pemmet> ya
[18:35:48] <pemmet> it fluctuates between 1.4 and 1.5
[18:35:49] <pemmet> ohms
[18:35:56] <SWPadnos> that's fine
[18:36:24] <SWPadnos> now just switch it to VDC, and connect the ground lead to the case somewhere and the + lead to one of the two power lines
[18:36:32] <pemmet> sweet
[18:36:33] <pemmet> i just got it
[18:36:40] <pemmet> it came up 5.1 ish volts
[18:36:46] <SWPadnos> that's close enough
[18:36:54] <pemmet> and the other one, 11.8
[18:36:59] <pemmet> that's my five and twelve
[18:37:00] <pemmet> sweet
[18:37:03] <pemmet> thanks, swp..
[18:37:19] <SWPadnos> np
[18:41:51] <paul_c> pemmet: You're not doing electronics are you ?
[18:42:20] <Dmess> gonna let the smoke out...
[18:47:12] <Dmess> Dmess: is trying to compose a letter to get RIM to PAY to attend a Tradeshow he's orginizing... and it don't look so good batman
[18:52:40] <Jymmm> les : just read your post about frying gecko drives; you ever come up with a conclusion by chance?
[19:03:18] <paul_c> and back.
[19:03:26] <anonimasu> wb
[19:05:37] <Jymmm> Hola!
[19:17:55] <anonimasu> * anonimasu is writing code to get coolant working
[19:20:12] <paul_c> outb(<addr>, 1);
[19:20:53] <SWPadnos> or even extDioWrite(CoolantBit, 1);
[19:21:28] <anonimasu> paul_c: plc > relay
[19:21:43] <paul_c> (NMLmsh*) coolant_on_msg
[19:22:03] <SWPadnos> Click (as I push the button) :)
[19:22:18] <SWPadnos> (though I guess that's not really code)
[19:27:23] <anonimasu> heh
[19:27:26] <anonimasu> helpful.
[19:31:44] <Jymmm> Eh... spindel spinning == coolant_flow!
[19:33:11] <anonimasu> hm, that's not my issue.. I cant run flood coolant
[19:33:35] <anonimasu> but I have a homebuilt ejector pump that I'll run..
[19:33:42] <anonimasu> and just pulse the coolant in intervals..
[19:33:57] <anonimasu> so when I dont have the fluid on I get air..
[19:33:58] <Jymmm> mist coolant?
[19:34:14] <anonimasu> no
[19:34:23] <anonimasu> cant run that... since I have not vent..
[19:34:35] <anonimasu> no
[19:34:41] <anonimasu> so it's a bad idea..
[19:35:41] <Jymmm> you need ventilation for mist coolant?
[19:36:57] <anonimasu> oh, my eyes speak for themselves
[19:37:17] <Jymmm> isn't that what guards/shields are for ? =)
[19:37:27] <anonimasu> I dont have that either..
[19:37:42] <anonimasu> I ran it a bit with less coolant so it caused mist instead..
[19:38:12] <anonimasu> the fog in the shop talked for itself
[19:38:13] <anonimasu> :)
[19:38:14] <Jymmm> anonimasun plexiglass is cheap =)
[19:38:39] <anonimasu> Jymmm: yeah, but I do not have time to build a enclosure..
[19:38:42] <Jymmm> anonimasu trash bag is even cheaper =)
[19:38:45] <anonimasu> yet
[19:38:52] <anonimasu> acutally cost is irrelevant..
[19:38:53] <Jymmm> trash bag + duct tape =)
[19:38:55] <anonimasu> time is worse :)
[19:39:49] <anonimasu> I wish I could run flood coolant that'd solve loads of problem
[19:39:49] <anonimasu> s
[19:40:38] <Jymmm> I was just watching the video here
http://www.datrondynamics.com/ it seems the mist coolant only engages when the cutter is in contact with the stock, then stops when raised
[19:40:50] <anonimasu> what did you think of the speed?
[19:41:04] <Jymmm> anonimasu too slow
[19:41:26] <Jymmm> anonimasu: My $500 one will cut twice as fst!
[19:41:29] <Jymmm> fast
[19:41:42] <anonimasu> Jymmm: well the vital card you will need kills your budget.
[19:41:49] <anonimasu> :D
[19:41:54] <Jymmm> anonimasu I'm kidding!
[19:41:57] <anonimasu> I know
[19:42:02] <anonimasu> I crave for that speed..
[19:42:05] <anonimasu> really
[19:42:12] <Jymmm> three times as fast!!!!
[19:42:13] <anonimasu> i dont care for ferrous materials..
[19:42:28] <anonimasu> at thoose feedrates milling alu is efficicent
[19:42:28] <anonimasu> ;)
[19:42:42] <Jymmm> anonimasu oh you want an aluminum frame on a car or roolcage?!
[19:42:44] <Jymmm> roll
[19:43:19] <anonimasu> aluminium frame wouldnt be too bad..
[19:43:53] <Jymmm> eh, maybe
[19:43:55] <anonimasu> nah..
[19:44:00] <anonimasu> not if you have a motorcycle engine ;)
[19:44:33] <anonimasu> Jymmm: the racing car I am working on at work has aluminium wheel hubs..
[19:44:48] <anonimasu> and kevlar * to keep the weight down..
[19:45:08] <Jymmm> wheel hubs?! eh, no thanks
[19:45:20] <anonimasu> it's a division1 racing car..
[19:45:29] <anonimasu> awd + 550hp
[19:46:05] <anonimasu> I think the guys designing/building it knows what they are doing
[19:46:20] <Jymmm> as long as I'm not driving it!
[19:47:12] <anonimasu> actually it'd be fun to test drive it..
[19:47:32] <anonimasu> they use black primer because it weighs less then other colors..
[19:47:37] <Jymmm> I'd still prefer a steel rollcage
[19:47:58] <anonimasu> heh the rollcage is chrome moly
[19:48:07] <anonimasu> same as they use in WRC
[19:48:31] <Jymmm> doesn't chromemolly have "brittle" properties to it? Somewhat slightly like cast iron?
[19:48:31] <anonimasu> well it's classed the same..
[19:49:14] <anonimasu> that cage is probably more expensive then my car..
[19:49:14] <anonimasu> heh
[19:50:04] <Jymmm> Hey they can make the parts on my $500 cnc router!
[19:50:37] <anonimasu> lol
[19:51:13] <anonimasu> How far have you gotten?
[19:52:57] <Jymmm> Alot still in my head. Going to start CADing it up today. I'm still asorta in a delima on size,
[19:53:15] <anonimasu> ok
[19:53:33] <Jymmm> I'm sorta thinking 24" x 18" x 6"
[19:53:47] <Jymmm> I'm sorta thinking 36" x 18" x 6"
[19:55:05] <anonimasu> that sounds like a ok size
[19:55:47] <Jymmm> like I said, I'm undecided. could be 18x24 or 24x26
[19:56:07] <Jymmm> I want the 6" only incase someone wants to do boxes
[19:56:19] <Jymmm> engraving I mean
[19:56:55] <Jymmm> It's ALWAYS bugged me when I see Z's be so small
[19:57:08] <anonimasu> hm, you will need a VERY VERY rigid machine..
[19:57:12] <les> hello
[19:57:22] <Jymmm> howdy Mr Les
[19:57:43] <anonimasu> Jymmm: the trouble with long Z travel is that the machine has to be extremely rigid or it'll flex..
[19:57:44] <Jymmm> anonimasu I'll give it viagra then =)
[19:57:49] <anonimasu> hey les
[19:58:45] <les> hmm got some pretty good quotes on spindles
[19:59:07] <les> except for ones with auto drawbars
[19:59:17] <anonimasu> hm
[19:59:26] <anonimasu> you should go for one like that it'll save you in the long run
[19:59:40] <les> Just that feature cost about $5000 more
[19:59:44] <anonimasu> :/
[19:59:49] <les> yeah.
[19:59:53] <anonimasu> hm, ouch
[20:00:03] <Jymmm> les what else you gonna do with your money?!
[20:00:09] <anonimasu> how much time do you have to spend changing tools to make it worthwile
[20:00:24] <Jymmm> les buy another pick em up truck?! =)
[20:00:41] <anonimasu> ?
[20:01:06] <paul_c> Ohmygod... Not content with tagging criminals, they want to get evryone before they're born...
http://www.theregister.co.uk/2005/04/01/embryo_tagging/
[20:01:08] <les> well changing 20 or 30 a day sure gets old
[20:01:48] <anonimasu> count the time it takes to change a tool manually
[20:01:57] <les> I have
[20:02:06] <anonimasu> hm.. ok
[20:02:13] <les> about a minute if I hurry
[20:02:18] <anonimasu> ok
[20:02:20] <les> two if I am not
[20:02:35] <anonimasu> hm, ok
[20:02:41] <les> so as much as an hour a day is changing tools
[20:03:18] <anonimasu> :(
[20:03:22] <anonimasu> that's lots
[20:03:34] <Jymmm> paul_c Sounds X-Files to me =)
[20:03:42] <SWPadnos> well - a high-school kid only costs around $8/hour
[20:03:51] <les> Auto tool changer is a no brainer on that basis...but must consider cash flow too
[20:04:14] <anonimasu> yeah
[20:04:16] <SWPadnos> so, you can have them changing tools for roughly 600 hours for the $5k spindle
[20:04:26] <SWPadnos> ($5k drawbar)
[20:04:30] <les> yeah
[20:04:32] <anonimasu> think about yourself also...
[20:04:36] <anonimasu> :)
[20:04:42] <les> heh
[20:04:48] <anonimasu> if you go insane who will machine the calls?
[20:05:06] <SWPadnos> there's a pretty nice little drawbar system that uses an air wrench as the actuator
[20:05:10] <Jymmm> anonimasu whos says he isn't already?
[20:05:16] <les> heh
[20:05:23] <anonimasu> Jymmm: relative to how he is now..
[20:05:37] <SWPadnos> Jymmm: obviously he is, otherwise why would he be making turkey calls? :)
[20:05:38] <les> you mean crazier...
[20:05:38] <Jymmm> anonimasu that swhat I'm talking about
[20:05:46] <anonimasu> yeah
[20:06:32] <Jymmm> Think about it... he's in the middle of nowhere on 12+ acres with nobody around... RedRum RedRum RedRum RedRum
[20:07:07] <les> the cat and chicken are around
[20:07:19] <dmessLive> I finally got EMC Live to stick to this system..
[20:07:32] <SWPadnos> what version?
[20:07:46] <dmessLive> live46
[20:08:19] <SWPadnos> les: make something like this, and save yourself $4795:
http://cgi.ebay.com/ws/eBayISAPI.dll?ViewItem&item=5571249931
[20:10:48] <les> I think air powered drawbars at 24000 rpm are a different animal
[20:11:06] <SWPadnos> how so?
[20:11:15] <les> not sure
[20:11:19] <SWPadnos> fair enough
[20:11:29] <les> must be a reason they cost so much more
[20:11:52] <SWPadnos> even a Kurt retrofit will run you $1000 or so from MSC
[20:12:13] <les> the bearing for these thing are the better part of $1000
[20:12:38] <SWPadnos> the drawbar loosener shouldn't be engaged when the spindle is running
[20:13:17] <les> so spring loaded closed?
[20:13:26] <SWPadnos> probably air solenoid, but yes
[20:13:30] <anonimasu> yeah...
[20:13:38] <anonimasu> I saw some vertex ones..
[20:13:53] <anonimasu> they were pretty nice but wouldnt go over 3400 rpm since they were following the spindle.. around
[20:13:58] <dmessLive> bellville washer type springs n real machines
[20:14:22] <anonimasu> yeah, but retrofitting a machine like that isnt easy if you dont have enough taper..
[20:14:45] <SWPadnos> basic steps: engage solenoid, slow spin wrench (to set onto the hex drawbar head), rapid spin off, second pull with solenoid (to release tool)
[20:15:06] <les> best street price I have here for a 10 hp is $6080
[20:15:47] <les> without...(er collet) $2000
[20:17:33] <les> hmm the whole tool change thing sounds pretty easy then
[20:18:44] <les> used working 10hp perke manual....
[20:18:45] <SWPadnos> I don't think it's rocket science, but I'm sure there are non-obvious details :)
[20:18:47] <les> $350
[20:19:10] <les> Yeah I think I will search a little on it
[20:19:25] <dmessLive> tool dolly is easy to program...
[20:19:36] <les> sound like it
[20:19:43] <les> sounds
[20:19:53] <les> simple plc stuff
[20:20:24] <dmessLive> or just macro/variable programming
[20:20:32] <les> yeah
[20:21:04] <SWPadnos> man - I've gotta study this PLC crap - I have I/O boards that could pretty easily be turned into little PLCs.
[20:21:39] <SWPadnos> All I'd need (famous last words) would be a program to allow someone to program them
[20:22:00] <anonimasu> SWPadnos: you could write a ladder parser
[20:22:16] <SWPadnos> If only I knew what it had to do :)
[20:22:29] <SWPadnos> that's why I say aI should study a bit
[20:23:34] <SWPadnos> I have a new board with 8 inputs and 16 outputs, a few LEDs and jumpers, and an AVR chip - sounds like it could be a nice little PLC.
[20:23:54] <SWPadnos> (if I had put a serial port on that one - hmmm :) )
[20:26:06] <robin_sz> meep?
[20:26:15] <SWPadnos> mop
[20:26:27] <robin_sz> so, wie gehts?
[20:26:34] <anonimasu> * anonimasu yawns
[20:27:30] <les> hi robin
[20:27:36] <robin_sz> hi les ..
[20:30:40] <Jymmm> hey robin_sz!
[20:33:23] <robin_sz> hi
[20:46:19] <bagi> some question about emc
[20:47:53] <bagi> some question about emc
[20:47:57] <les> yes Bagi?
[20:48:33] <bagi> i am coming from Germany. so my english is not so good
[20:49:03] <les> no problem some speak german here I think
[20:50:22] <les> but go ahead with your questions
[20:50:40] <bagi> on my Isel mill. i have a microstep steppercontoller on one ISA-board inside the pc cal�led MPK3. the software for this Card is very bad.
[20:51:11] <bagi> how difficult is the driver development with emc ?
[20:51:44] <les> can the steppercontroller accept logic level step and direction signals?
[20:52:08] <bagi> no, this is the problem.
[20:52:23] <les> what do they accept?
[20:52:35] <les> rs232?
[20:53:35] <SWPadnos> it's an internal ISA card - that's probably the problem...
[20:53:52] <bagi> the current for each coil of the motor (2 coils - bipolar ) has to be set with one 8-Bit Port per coil.
[20:54:20] <cradek> that should be an easy modification to emcmot.c
[20:54:52] <les> ah thank god you are here heh
[20:55:19] <cradek> bagi: so there is a pattern of bits you have to send to some IO port for each motor?
[20:55:30] <cradek> les: :-)
[20:55:31] <bagi> what is the better base - emc or emc2?
[20:56:02] <cradek> bagi: emc is the stable program, emc2 is the development work in progress
[20:56:20] <cradek> bagi: so that's a hard question to answer
[20:57:23] <cradek> bagi: are you a C programmer?
[20:57:58] <bagi> at the moment i have no schematik of the card . i had to rengineer if all 8 Bits are used for Microstepping.
[20:58:41] <bagi> I have written some c programms for embedded devices
[20:59:49] <cradek> do you know the pattern of bytes that is written to the IO port to make the motor turn?
[21:00:41] <bagi> yes i have some pattern for 1/16 Stepping
[21:00:52] <cradek> good!
[21:00:56] <cradek> look at emc/src/emcmot/emcmot.c
[21:01:10] <cradek> around line 4540
[21:03:01] <cradek> you will want to make a function like lpg_phase_drive() that uses your larger table
[21:03:31] <cradek> then modify the calls to extDioByteWrite to write them to the right ports.
[21:03:55] <cradek> (if you want to use emc1)
[21:04:20] <cradek> if you want to use emc2 you will have to get help from one of the guys who do the HAL (hardware abstraction layer)
[21:06:47] <bagi> it is not easier to mod the tnb_fourphase_drive for more states?
[21:07:21] <cradek> they are almost the same
[21:07:42] <cradek> with both of these functions, there are multiple motors on one IO port
[21:08:14] <cradek> if your cards have a separate IO port for each motor, your code will be much simpler
[21:09:22] <bagi> thanks cradek, i will look tomorow deeper in the code and try to get some more infos of the card.
[21:09:31] <cradek> you're welcome
[21:09:42] <cradek> if you need help, come back here, or ask on the mailing list
[21:10:09] <bagi> the mailing list at sourceforge ?
[21:10:42] <cradek> [email protected]
[21:10:57] <cradek> but probably asking here is better
[21:11:24] <cradek> I am usually here 1500-2100 UTC
[21:11:29] <cradek> approximately
[21:13:13] <cradek> I'm leaving now, goodbye all
[21:13:29] <bagi> goodbye
[22:03:52] <jmkasunich> is paul_c watching?
[22:09:10] <paul_c> No
[22:10:01] <jmkasunich> after the frustration sunday, I've about decided I should just go spend a couple hundred bucks and buy something halfway modern to use as my main (BDI-4.xx/Debian) compuyter
[22:10:06] <paul_c> Got a problem with the motion queue being emptied faster than it can be filled.
[22:10:19] <jmkasunich> lots of short moves?
[22:10:29] <paul_c> yup
[22:10:48] <jmkasunich> don't do that
[22:11:17] <dmessLive> need more buffer
[22:12:19] <jmkasunich> I was hoping to pick paul's mind (and others as well) as far as computer recomendations
[22:12:28] <jmkasunich> like AMD vs Intel, etc
[22:12:47] <jmkasunich> and what works good with linux, specifically BDI-4.x
[22:12:54] <Jymmm> jmkasunich : memory, lots and lots of memory!
[22:13:05] <jmkasunich> 512M?
[22:13:08] <paul_c> loadsa memory, fast CPU, avoid i8xx chipsets
[22:13:19] <Jymmm> jmkasunich 2 or 3 GB
[22:13:33] <jmkasunich> NFW... I'm not gonna spend that much
[22:13:48] <paul_c> 1Gig of memory is way plenty
[22:13:52] <dmessLive> somuch for linux being minimalistic eh..
[22:14:01] <jmkasunich> remember, I'm upgrading from 600MHz P3 w/384M, mostly using dumpster grade boxes
[22:14:12] <Jymmm> 1gig is unless youre going todo design work on the same machien
[22:14:49] <jmkasunich> if you guys are serious, then you've just talked me out of BDI4, Deb, and anything newer than 2001
[22:15:02] <jmkasunich> that's fscking ridiculous
[22:15:41] <paul_c> * paul_c is running BDI-4 on a 433MHz celeron with 256meg of memory
[22:15:47] <Jymmm> 512MB is $40 after rebate
[22:16:00] <jmkasunich> that's more like it paul
[22:16:34] <Jymmm> and that's PC3200 too
[22:16:37] <paul_c> Sherline ship 2.4GHz boxes with 256Meg memory.
[22:17:11] <jmkasunich> I was thinking 512M
[22:17:25] <Jymmm> EVERY machine I've ever owned has always maxed the memory limit and was better off for doing so too
[22:17:28] <jmkasunich> and about 2.5-3GHz, or the AMD eqiuvalent
[22:17:52] <jmkasunich> Jymmm - memory can be added later as well
[22:18:13] <jmkasunich> but that is a good argument for 1x512M dimm instead of 2x256
[22:18:17] <jmkasunich> leaves more open slots
[22:18:42] <Jymmm> start with a gig, then make it 2gig later on
[22:18:56] <paul_c> I would say fix your budget and shop to it.
[22:19:59] <jmkasunich> I intend to buy parts and build... mobo, ram, cpu, and video to start
[22:20:24] <jmkasunich> hoping to use one of my existing industrial rackmount cases with the nice filtered fans and such
[22:20:25] <Jymmm> jmkasunich look at buying a cheapy complete system then just upgrading it
[22:20:45] <paul_c> Take a look at a bare bones box - I found it as cheap & it came ready tested.
[22:20:49] <jmkasunich> the really cheap ones ($399) use shared ram for video
[22:21:04] <paul_c> Avoid those
[22:21:15] <jmkasunich> already knew that mich
[22:21:17] <jmkasunich> much
[22:21:40] <Jymmm> jmkasunich SO? just install a different video card later on
[22:21:42] <jmkasunich> anyway, I kinda like the rackmount cases - barebones gives you a traditional tower usually
[22:22:11] <Jymmm> a barebones system for $180 isn't too shabby
[22:22:26] <paul_c> $200 for a rack case..
[22:22:35] <jmkasunich> just the case?
[22:22:41] <jmkasunich> or a barebones in the case?
[22:22:55] <Jymmm> there is no such thing as a barebones rack mount
[22:23:01] <jmkasunich> didn't think so
[22:23:23] <Jymmm> jmkasunich outpost.com search for 4199563
[22:23:31] <paul_c> Jymmm: You are using the wrong suppliers
[22:23:44] <Jymmm> paul_c I have fry's ad in front of me
[22:23:47] <jmkasunich> so if I use my existing rackmount case, I save $200, which can buy an inexpensive mobo and AMD Sempron 2500+ cpu
[22:24:13] <Jymmm> jmkasunich this ad is for a sempron XP2200+
[22:24:36] <Jymmm> 128 DDR, 40gb, 52x 10/100 56K
[22:24:58] <paul_c> skip the modem
[22:25:11] <jmkasunich> Jymmm: I want more RAM, don't need drives (have several) don't need modem, don't need NIC (have several)
[22:25:30] <jmkasunich> don't need cdrom or r/w (have several)
[22:25:34] <Jymmm> jmkasunich nm
[22:25:38] <Jymmm> * Jymmm gives up
[22:26:00] <jmkasunich> sorry, I'm more looking for recommendations about linux compatibility
[22:26:26] <jmkasunich> the other day Paul said something about nvidia being among the most compatible video cards, for example
[22:28:43] <jmkasunich> http://www.microcenter.com/single_product_results.phtml?product_id=170146
[22:28:48] <jmkasunich> $35 after rebate
[22:30:44] <paul_c> * paul_c doesn't recall saying much about nvidia
[22:31:07] <jmkasunich> oops... maybe it was somebody else then
[22:31:54] <jmkasunich> to be honest, I thought I read a doc that said nvidia was _not_ so good about enabling open source drivers, but I think that doc was quite old
[22:32:45] <jmkasunich> are there any URLs that evaluate stuff for Linux compatibility?
[22:36:28] <paul_c> I don't have any problems using ATI cards, and most people seem to be happy with nvidia
[22:36:46] <jmkasunich> thanks, that's the kind of info I'm looking for
[22:36:58] <jmkasunich> in the past, I think you said you use Athlon instead of intel?
[22:37:34] <jepler> cradek's emc machine is an athlon. it runs great.
[22:37:42] <paul_c> Most of my boxes are AMD, yes.
[22:37:45] <jepler> I'm using an athlon right now for that matter
[22:37:46] <jmkasunich> from what I've seen, seems loke more bang for the buck than intel
[22:37:53] <jmkasunich> s/loke/like
[22:38:38] <Jymmm> from what I've seen, most go with AMD for overclocking in games.
[22:39:23] <jmkasunich> my plan is to get mobo, cpu, ram, and video card, use CD-ROM and R/W drives, HDDs, and NIC that I already have
[22:40:31] <jmkasunich> mobo and video card linux compatibility are the key question
[22:40:49] <Jymmm> A mobo/cpu alone is gonna cost you $200+ not to mention case/memory
[22:41:02] <jmkasunich> I have the case already
[22:41:10] <Jymmm> fine
[22:41:21] <jmkasunich> unfortunately I know next to nothing about modern mobos
[22:41:42] <Jymmm> does your cse have a 350watt ps ?
[22:42:02] <paul_c> What style of MoBo are you currently using ?
[22:42:19] <jmkasunich> I can get this mobo
http://www.microcenter.com/single_product_results.phtml?product_id=0181643 and a sempron 2400+ cpu for $99, but I don't know how good they are
[22:42:54] <jmkasunich> depends on which box ;-)
[22:43:20] <jmkasunich> I believe at least some of my boxes take ATX
[22:44:06] <paul_c> onboard nic
[22:44:11] <jmkasunich> * jmkasunich measures
[22:46:01] <jmkasunich> the case I have in mind takes several sizes... what's in there now is 12" x 7.75" (ATX is supposed to be 12" x 9.6")
[22:46:14] <jmkasunich> but there are mounting holes that appear to take full size ATX
[22:46:33] <paul_c> take the case with you to the shop.
[22:46:46] <jmkasunich> good idea
[22:47:43] <jmkasunich> also need to check the power supply... the existing one is only 180W, hopefully the physical size is standarized and a replacement will fit
[22:48:11] <paul_c> unless you have one of those mini PSUs
[22:50:00] <jmkasunich> shame I can't put a modern mobo into the case I was working with on sunday
[22:51:16] <paul_c> passive backplane ?
[22:51:51] <jmkasunich> 2U server, HP proprietary MB with riser for PCI slots, 2 slot SCSI hot-plug bays
[22:52:07] <jmkasunich> I do have another system here with a pseudo-passive backplane
[22:52:38] <jmkasunich> P2-550MHz on a daughterboard, something like 8 ISA slots on one side and 7 or 8 PCI on the other side
[22:52:47] <jmkasunich> got lots of cards? ;-)
[22:53:17] <paul_c> You can also get active backplanes..
[22:53:25] <SWPadnos> You might be able to fit a standard PSU in the case, but I'd check that first
[22:53:34] <jmkasunich> that ones 6U high though, too bulky
[22:53:54] <jmkasunich> the one I'm looking to use is 4U
[22:54:11] <jmkasunich> PS is about 6" x 5.5" x 3.5"
[22:54:16] <SWPadnos> any reasonably modern mobo will have 10/100 (and possibly 1000) ethernet onboard
[22:54:48] <SWPadnos> there are two main places I use for parts: Mwave and Newegg
[22:54:55] <jmkasunich> so the half-dozen or so free 3-com NICs I have are just wasting storage space? ;-)
[22:55:12] <SWPadnos> yes :)
[22:55:31] <SWPadnos> though they could offload a little network work from the CPU, if they're high end 3Coms
[22:55:45] <jmkasunich> 3C905's IIRC
[22:55:56] <SWPadnos> I was looking for the good ones
[22:56:05] <SWPadnos> maybe 3C590 or something (can't remember though)
[22:56:31] <jmkasunich> these former HP servers have a high end Intel NIC in them
[22:56:36] <SWPadnos> you'll find that a new case costs less than a separate power supply
[22:56:48] <SWPadnos> (case with PS)
[22:56:49] <jmkasunich> afraid of that
[22:57:05] <SWPadnos> but then, you get to pick the brand if you buy separates
[22:57:08] <jmkasunich> it really comes down to how much I want the rackmount/horizontal form factor
[22:57:18] <SWPadnos> put the tower on its side
[22:57:31] <jmkasunich> the problem with picking brands is that I haven't been following the industry, I don't know what is good
[22:57:53] <SWPadnos> it also varies by the week.
[22:58:02] <jmkasunich> the cases I have are industrial quality, with filters, etc.. not just a tower on it's side ;-)
[22:58:46] <jmkasunich> my problem (one of many) is that I'm a fscking cheapskate
[22:59:04] <SWPadnos> that is a problem
[22:59:06] <SWPadnos> :)
[22:59:14] <Jymmm> jmkasunich DUH! =)
[22:59:36] <jmkasunich> from where I sit I can see 9 boxes that I didn't pay anything at all for
[22:59:37] <Jymmm> jmkasunich I was trying to tell you an easy/cheap way of going about it
[22:59:38] <SWPadnos> $378 for a barebones with MB, CPU, 1G, CDROM, floppy
[22:59:44] <SWPadnos> and case
[22:59:48] <Jymmm> SWPadnos $180
[22:59:58] <jmkasunich> it's hard for somebody like me to spend money on another computer
[23:00:07] <SWPadnos> Kingston RAM, Abit MB, Antec case, Lite-On CDRW, etc.
[23:01:44] <SWPadnos> gotta run - see ya
[23:01:55] <SWPadnos> SWPadnos is now known as SWP_Away
[23:02:37] <jmkasunich> Jymmm: I understand what you are saying...
[23:03:31] <Jymmm> jmkasunich I have a shit load of system here, and I PAID for them... so feel lucky you only have to buy one and have been able to get away with it this long =)
[23:04:08] <Jymmm> I even have a box full of 30pin simms!
[23:04:18] <Jymmm> all of it useless
[23:04:22] <jmkasunich> I know
[23:04:38] <jmkasunich> I got rid of my 30 pin SIMMs... still have lots of 72 pins ones tho ;-)
[23:04:44] <jmkasunich> packrat syndrome
[23:04:45] <Jymmm> use what you have to automated the lighting aroudn the house of soemthing =)
[23:05:47] <Jymmm> make them usefull for dedicated stuff.... maybe a mp3 jukebox or something
[23:05:54] <jmkasunich> what I have ranges from P1-200 to P3-600... I _want_ something nice, but have a hard time justifying it in my cheapskate mind with all the rest sitting around
[23:05:55] <Jymmm> dvd jukebox
[23:06:14] <jmkasunich> machine controller ;-)
[23:06:49] <Jymmm> jmkasunich: Here... instead of thinking of those as computers... mkae thme dedicated to doing things... they'll still serve a purpose.
[23:07:02] <jmkasunich> maybe I should start putting some stuff _back_ in the dumpster at work
[23:07:02] <les> well it's comforting to know that some folks are frugal and get what they need without laying out a bunch of cash
[23:07:34] <les> I'm not one of those ...one of MY many faults
[23:07:35] <Jymmm> les I got rid of two PALLETS worht a few years ago
[23:07:43] <jmkasunich> my parents grew up in the Depression... and they passed their traits on to me
[23:07:53] <Jymmm> les these were all personal stuff, not dumpster dived
[23:07:57] <les> same here jmk
[23:08:12] <jmkasunich> use it up, wear it out, make do, or do without
[23:08:13] <les> but the traits did not pass
[23:08:35] <Jymmm> jmkasunich I'm understnad what your saying. That's why I suggested reusing them for other things instead.
[23:08:55] <Jymmm> jmkasunich do yo know how easy it is to make a jukebox out of those?
[23:09:05] <jmkasunich> yes... one is the EMC compile farm (I hope to bring it back up before fest)
[23:09:26] <Jymmm> jmkasunich just get a 2ware card off ebay and load in 8 hdd's
[23:09:30] <Jymmm> 3ware
[23:09:59] <jmkasunich> my wife has an Ipod, I'm not much of a music listener myself...
[23:10:14] <jmkasunich> I'd like to have one as a firewall/router
[23:10:18] <Jymmm> jmkasunich probably becaseu it's not convientant for you
[23:10:40] <jmkasunich> perhaps
[23:11:37] <Jymmm> 12 hdd's -->
http://cgi.ebay.com/ws/eBayISAPI.dll?ViewItem&category=39968&item=5181468842&rd=1
[23:11:52] <Jymmm> jmkasunich with that you can use all those old hdd's
[23:12:21] <jmkasunich> just need a case and PS to run them all
[23:12:39] <jmkasunich> actually, I have more SCSI disks than IDE, and I have a DAC960 RAID card
[23:12:59] <Jymmm> well, there ya go! I'm just trying to give you suggestions is all.
[23:13:03] <jmkasunich> I have 6 or 7 fast (5.4mS IIRC) 18G SCSI drives
[23:13:59] <jmkasunich> of course, one modern IDE drive gives more space, nearly the same speed, and far less power consumption and noise
[23:14:18] <jmkasunich> the more I sit here and talk to you guys, the more I realise I bring home far too much junk
[23:14:43] <gezr> jmkasunich : I wish I had access to junk
[23:15:06] <jmkasunich> it's a two edged sword gezr ;-)
[23:15:12] <Jymmm> See, I've over here right now playing with 3d CAD and my video card is just too old/slow for it that it keeps redrawing the screen whenever I try to do anything. Now, I COULD go buy the best damn video card I could find but this P3 800 is just too old to truely handle the new card. Such a vicious circle.
[23:15:29] <jmkasunich> right
[23:15:31] <gezr> I tend to pretend I bid and won something on ebay, and then when i close the browser i pretend its 10 years in the future, and Im finally tossing out it
[23:15:45] <jmkasunich> roflmao
[23:15:52] <Jymmm> gezr lol
[23:16:21] <Jymmm> jmkasunich come on ya cheaper bastard... I'm the one over here trying to build a $500 CNC router... alright?!
[23:16:40] <jmkasunich> want a free computer to run it?
[23:16:42] <jmkasunich> ;-)
[23:17:01] <Jymmm> jmkasunich does it includ *FREE* S&H ?!?!?!?!?!?!?! =)
[23:17:04] <gezr> I mean seriously, I dont have money to really buy gunk, but if I did, I would have a junk yard, and a business
[23:17:15] <jmkasunich> depends, where are you?
[23:17:20] <Jymmm> SFO
[23:17:35] <jmkasunich> that sounds westish
[23:17:48] <Jymmm> 40 minutes south of Golden Gate Brdidge
[23:17:56] <Jymmm> San Jsoe Californai
[23:18:02] <jmkasunich> no free S&H for you
[23:18:15] <Jymmm> see, I can be a cheap bastard too
[23:18:34] <jmkasunich> which reminds me, I should be upstairs and outside enjoying the 65 degrees, instead of in here talking about computers
[23:18:43] <jmkasunich> snow's almost all melted
[23:19:34] <jmkasunich> on a serious note, maybe I should bring some of my choicer "junk" to fest and see if I can palm it off on people
[23:19:49] <gezr> I need a small worm and gear
[23:20:01] <jmkasunich> that passive backplane system would be handy if somebody wanted to test cards... lots of slots
[23:20:10] <gezr> with exactly 40 50 60 72 90 or 100 teeth
[23:20:21] <jmkasunich> gezr: you have a mill?
[23:20:46] <gezr> yeah yeah, the 50 and 100 arnt quiet degreific, but they are magicaly devidable
[23:20:58] <jmkasunich> I've made worm gears before
[23:21:01] <gezr> jmkasunich : yeah, yeah, ive got the yeah, and yeah, and yeah
[23:21:20] <jmkasunich> ?
[23:21:28] <gezr> yeah I could make them :)
[23:21:44] <jmkasunich> but have better things to do with your spare hours?
[23:21:47] <gezr> jmkasunich : my stuff is pretty limited, the big issue i have is gashing the hobb
[23:22:22] <gezr> using a dremell mounted in a milling atatchment on a lathe to position and grind the flutes is just embarassing
[23:22:30] <jmkasunich> http://www.metalworking.com/DropBox/_2001_retired_files/Worm06.jpg
[23:22:49] <jmkasunich> gashing cutter and hob
[23:23:06] <jmkasunich> http://www.metalworking.com/DropBox/_2001_retired_files/Worm08.jpg
[23:23:08] <gezr> yeah, those look good
[23:23:11] <jmkasunich> setup for gashing
[23:23:38] <jmkasunich> http://www.metalworking.com/DropBox/_2001_retired_files/Worm10.jpg
[23:23:40] <jmkasunich> and hobbing
[23:23:43] <gezr> jmkasunich : I have to ask. Is that a deviding head below?
[23:23:47] <jmkasunich> yes
[23:24:04] <jmkasunich> http://www.metalworking.com/DropBox/_2001_retired_files/Worm07.jpg
[23:24:07] <gezr> most exleclent
[23:24:16] <jmkasunich> overall view of gashing setup
[23:24:22] <gezr> I need the worm and gear for my dividing head :)
[23:24:35] <jmkasunich> that can be a problem ;-)
[23:25:01] <jmkasunich> dividing heads show up on ebay all the time, and are often reasonably priced
[23:25:03] <gezr> wow now
[23:25:11] <gezr> they are too big for my mill
[23:25:15] <jmkasunich> oh
[23:25:25] <jmkasunich> you need a leetle tiny one, sherline sized?
[23:25:26] <gezr> you have the gear tilted at the helix of the worm?
[23:25:29] <jmkasunich> yes
[23:25:43] <gezr> yeah, that size, but a bit better
[23:25:56] <gezr> hmm
[23:26:01] <jmkasunich> the dividing head is an ellis, bought it at a plant closing auction for $150 or so
[23:26:01] <gezr> im still looking at the tilting
[23:26:13] <gezr> yeah, its a beautiful dividing head
[23:26:31] <jmkasunich> that pic doesn't show the tilting part so well
[23:26:32] <gezr> so the gear is cut at the tilt, and then it rests straight with the worm?
[23:26:37] <jmkasunich> yes
[23:26:56] <jmkasunich> for the hobbing step, the gear is 90 deg to the hob
[23:26:56] <gezr> hmm
[23:27:08] <gezr> ah okay
[23:27:14] <jmkasunich> the gashing cutter has no helix to it, the hob does
[23:27:15] <gezr> thats a gashing photo then?
[23:27:19] <jmkasunich> yes
[23:27:31] <jmkasunich> there's a whole series of photos and a text writeup
[23:27:38] <jmkasunich> http://www.metalworking.com/DropBox/_2001_retired_files/
[23:27:58] <jmkasunich> down near the bottom of the page, worm.txt and worm01.jpg thru worm11.jpg
[23:28:07] <gezr> I tried a blank run of one, without gashing, freewheel mode, and I was unable to get the proper tool track, eventually I was able to form a sweet gear, but it was way below where I started
[23:28:32] <jmkasunich> yeah, the gashing step is the key to having the hob drive the gear
[23:28:57] <gezr> I have an idea in my head that Im going to do some day, where I drive the gearblank
[23:29:15] <jmkasunich> then you can skip the gashing step - that's the pro way to do it
[23:29:41] <gezr> have you made say a spur gear?
[23:29:45] <jmkasunich> nope
[23:30:12] <gezr> its basically the same process as a worm gear but the gear is advanced across the cutter I think, and it pretty much is a must to have the blank driven
[23:30:13] <jmkasunich> that worm gear is part of a piece of lab equipment I built for a customer
[23:30:22] <jmkasunich> I've done about 7 of them over the last 4 years or so
[23:30:45] <jmkasunich> other than that I haven't done anything with gearmaking
[23:31:11] <gezr> its the only thing left in metalworking that just makes me act like a 10 year old
[23:32:11] <gezr> I can pick someones brains for hours reguarding gear making
[23:32:28] <gezr> I have some really good docs on it too
[23:32:37] <gezr> and photos and instructions for mechanisms
[23:32:54] <gezr> jmkasunich : do your table have a feed drive for it?
[23:32:58] <gezr> does
[23:33:06] <jmkasunich> yes, X only
[23:33:25] <gezr> is is an electronic thing?
[23:33:40] <gezr> like a powerfeed, or is it tied in to the spindle in some way?
[23:33:59] <jmkasunich> separate 1/4HP ac motor and 12 speed gearbox
[23:34:11] <jmkasunich> (mill is circa 1941, no electronics ;-)
[23:34:43] <jmkasunich> I did put a tiny VFD on the feed motor so I can dial in the feed I want
[23:35:01] <gezr> my little atlas, has a gearbox on the back that drives a shaft that turns the gear that moves the screw, I plan on using that drive rod to drive a single worm, that drives varous pitched gears to obtain the ratio
[23:35:45] <jmkasunich> gotta deal with different center distances them
[23:35:59] <jmkasunich> aren't spur gears easier (like lathe change gears)?
[23:36:24] <gezr> yeah, the worm's bearings will be on an adjustable slide so that it can contact the various diameters
[23:36:58] <gezr> yeah, spur gears would be ideal for sure, but I have to turn the corner
[23:37:07] <gezr> and then make the spur gears
[23:37:22] <gezr> to make the spur gears that im going to be making anyway
[23:37:58] <gezr> Im goign to be making a new set of spur gears for a southbend 9"
[23:38:34] <gezr> who knows, this is year #6 of that project
[23:39:16] <les> I was messin with the gear train on my boxford vsl...hobby stuff on the weekend
[23:39:22] <gezr> hahaha, oh well, someday, I have to go now, you guys take it easy
[23:39:28] <les> wanted to cut some 4tpi thereads
[23:39:44] <les> threads
[23:40:04] <gezr> did you find a way?
[23:40:43] <les> yeah it's qiuck change of course...but subbinf a 40 tooth gear for 20 lets you do 4tpi
[23:41:02] <les> that is the lowest
[23:41:13] <les> have to go real slow
[23:41:31] <gezr> I bet
[23:41:43] <les> had no problems
[23:41:54] <les> but it was hobby stuff
[23:41:57] <gezr> I dont like manually threading a coarse pitch, without a decent thread lenght to work with
[23:42:32] <les> on the weekend I go in the shop and just think...ok this is not work I can just goof around
[23:42:51] <gezr> were you able to pull out at about the same location?
[23:43:02] <les> yeah
[23:43:11] <les> I just went real slow
[23:43:19] <gezr> does your boxford have the half nut lever on the left side or right?
[23:43:29] <les> right
[23:44:02] <les> It is basically the same as a south bend heavy 10 but with tapered roller bearings in the spindle
[23:44:07] <gezr> oh nice
[23:44:21] <les> it is a nice small lathe
[23:44:37] <gezr> I bet its solid
[23:44:44] <les> it is
[23:44:59] <les> We bought 5 from Chicago city colleges
[23:45:06] <les> fixed em up
[23:45:13] <les> kept two
[23:45:17] <les> sold the rest
[23:46:20] <les> $1800 each
[23:46:26] <les> new $6000
[23:47:03] <jmkasunich> going out for a while
[23:47:07] <jmkasunich> jmkasunich is now known as jmk_away
[23:47:09] <les> later
[23:47:23] <gezr> I have to go as well
[23:47:32] <les> see you later gezr
[23:47:33] <gezr> Les : things going okay this week ?
[23:47:39] <les> yeah
[23:47:43] <les> big doins
[23:47:45] <gezr> cool :)
