#emc | Logs for 2007-01-26

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[00:00:08] <fenn> and btw tuxcnc.org is his fork of emc1, but "real" emc development continues at linuxcnc.org (if you didnt know)
[00:00:10] <SWPadnos> well, he does mention one sp[ecific file - smallmath.o
[00:00:50] <SWPadnos> oh, I love the final line there "Bootnote: The CVS repository at sourceforge has been shut down and no futher development will probably take place. "
[00:00:51] <SWPadnos> what a crock of shit
[00:01:15] <erDiZz> Question marks regarding licencing still remain over certain files along with definite copyright transgressions that are unlikely to be resolved. Anyone contemplating using the code for any other purpose other than personal use needs to conduct a full audit and read the user/developer mail archives (would be wise to consider the commit logs also).
[00:01:20] <erDiZz> http://www.tuxcnc.org/pivot/entry.php?id=7#body
[00:01:30] <erDiZz> sonds pretty offending
[00:01:31] <fenn> wtf is smallmath.o?
[00:01:46] <erDiZz> I thought he was a EMC developer, wasn't he?
[00:01:50] <fenn> yes he was
[00:01:57] <SWPLinux> I don't know, but it doesn't appear anywhere in the source tree (in any form)
[00:02:12] <erDiZz> I tend to trust the (ex)developer
[00:02:45] <SWPLinux> erDiZz: if you would like more up to date information regarding emc2, then I suggest you use http://www.linuxcnc.org
[00:02:56] <fenn> hah "Each module has a series of "pins" stuck in (almost like a voodoo doll), and to stop the bleeding, a Hardware Abstraction Layer (or HAL) is used to link everything together"
[00:03:12] <SWPLinux> hold on a second. he was "one of the developers", not one of the original developers at NIST
[00:03:41] <SWPLinux> he was brought on at some point around 6 years ago to make it easier to install EMC, and created the BDI
[00:04:07] <SWPLinux> he did a lot of good stuff (all GPL) over the years
[00:04:34] <SWPLinux> under no circumstances should you take his opinion as "the truth" or "the way it is" - it's just opinion until he points out actually offending code
[00:04:48] <fenn> its funny how people end up attacking a project because they have issues with specific people working on the project
[00:05:01] <erDiZz> maybe
[00:05:15] <fenn> ebo for example had a big fit with paul_c, but now "emc" is the problem in his mind
[00:05:52] <SWPLinux> actually, he has specific issues with one aspect of the project - HAL (IIRC). he has decided to pursue a non-HAL version of emc (though strangely, he disliked the myriad config files with HAL, but wants to move to a single XML based config now)
[00:06:23] <fenn> i think a single xml file would be a good idea
[00:06:29] <SWPLinux> I agree
[00:06:33] <erDiZz> well
[00:06:41] <SWPLinux> or at least a single file - doesn't need to be XML
[00:06:45] <fenn> right
[00:07:00] <erDiZz> it's a bit inconvinient to say, but I didn't understand the point of HAL from reading the docs
[00:07:10] <erDiZz> what's it (in a couple of words)?
[00:07:11] <fenn> hal is like a software breadboard
[00:07:14] <SWPLinux> it allows reconfiguration without recompiling
[00:07:16] <fenn> with IC's you can plug into it
[00:07:43] <erDiZz> reconfiguration of what?
[00:07:55] <erDiZz> different drive setups?
[00:07:56] <SWPLinux> it basically puts a user-configurable I/O layer between hardware and the EMC motion controller
[00:07:59] <fenn> its purpose is to make the insides of the computer more transparent (less of a mysterious black box)
[00:08:09] <SWPLinux> yes. change pins on the parallel port (on the fly, actually)
[00:08:16] <lerman> erDiZz: said that one should beware of copyright problems if using copyrighted code for commercial use. It is illegal to make copies of copyrighted material for personal use, private use, commercial use, or just about any use (except portions for so called "fair use")
[00:08:23] <SWPLinux> use a parallel port and another driver at the same time
[00:08:54] <erDiZz> ok, and what about the inputs? is there a set of standard input signals that EMC understands?
[00:09:12] <SWPLinux> those are also completely reconfigurable
[00:09:47] <SWPLinux> the motion controller has some specified inputs, but what they connect to (parallel port, motenc, 5i20 ...) can be changed at any time, without recompiling
[00:09:53] <erDiZz> could EMC be used to drive a wire EDM machine
[00:09:54] <erDiZz> ?
[00:09:56] <SWPLinux> yes
[00:10:12] <SWPLinux> it is being used for that by mdynac and tomp, I think
[00:10:14] <fenn> that was last year's group project
[00:10:19] <SWPLinux> also plasma (dallur?)
[00:10:32] <fenn> someone was doing laser etching and laser cutting
[00:10:47] <lerman> I thought that the issue of backing up (for wire EDM) hadn't been completely solved. Am I wrong?
[00:10:47] <erDiZz> so it controls spark interval as an input?
[00:10:55] <erDiZz> (that's how we call it in Russian...)
[00:10:58] <SWPLinux> lerman: you'r enot completely wrong ;)
[00:11:10] <fenn> is there a limited amount of backup?
[00:11:16] <fenn> backing up
[00:11:37] <erDiZz> does "backing up" mean moving backwards by the trajectory?
[00:11:43] <fenn> yes
[00:11:47] <SWPLinux> I don't think it can control the spark, but it can react to externally detected events by slowing down the feed
[00:12:00] <SWPLinux> no - the backup problem isn't solved yet
[00:12:05] <erDiZz> oh
[00:12:11] <erDiZz> that's what I wanted to ask
[00:12:21] <erDiZz> it's critical to me
[00:12:29] <erDiZz> that was the first thing I did in MyNC
[00:12:42] <SWPLinux> it's not an easy problem when you consider that an NC file can be a gigabyte long, and can't be buffered or pre-planned
[00:12:56] <lerman> How far back would one have to be able to go?
[00:13:07] <SWPLinux> depends on the kind of cutting tool
[00:13:08] <erDiZz> SWPLinux, yes, but the amount of backing-up is very limited
[00:13:28] <erDiZz> if you are not ok after a hundred of steps, than it's over
[00:13:35] <erDiZz> (then)
[00:13:47] <SWPLinux> wire EDM doesn't need much, but a more generic solution would have to account for undercuts like keyway cutters
[00:14:10] <SWPLinux> HAL can be used to back up a little bit, if you're a little creative
[00:14:14] <lerman> In that case, write a HAL buffering component that saved a limited history.
[00:14:19] <erDiZz> I've left long backing for later
[00:14:45] <SWPLinux> yeah - a 1k ring buffer wouldn't be too hard to do
[00:14:53] <fenn> hal seems like the wrong tool for this
[00:15:05] <fenn> it doesnt deal with serial data very well
[00:15:15] <erDiZz> for me that ring buffer is only 200 lines or so
[00:15:21] <erDiZz> write it once, forget it
[00:15:34] <lerman> In the long run, the interpreter could do this.
[00:15:38] <SWPLinux> it's wrong for the generic approach, but for a WEDM specific approach that has limited needs, it's fine
[00:15:39] <erDiZz> not exatly
[00:15:49] <erDiZz> the interpreter will be slow to respond
[00:15:57] <erDiZz> and you need to feed back immediately
[00:16:30] <SWPLinux> erDiZz: that's the beauty of HAL. you write the component that has a ring buffer, and that's it. to use it, you change a few lines of configuration data in a /hal file
[00:16:45] <erDiZz> sounds cool
[00:16:47] <SWPLinux> it's very modular
[00:17:07] <SWPLinux> then, someone else can use it for something you never thought of, by "wiring" it up differently
[00:17:12] <erDiZz> but if there'll be interpreter involved then it'll not be that easy
[00:17:21] <lerman> erDiZz: When you say the ring buffer is only 200 lines or so, what does that mean? Lines of what?
[00:17:29] <erDiZz> lines of C code
[00:17:46] <SWPLinux> nope. in HAL, you are writing small components, that run in either RT kernel space or in user space, and have a very well-defined interface to the rest of the system
[00:18:09] <SWPLinux> (so the interpreter isn't involved)
[00:18:12] <lerman> How much data do you buffer? How many seconds of data?
[00:18:31] <SWPLinux> loadrt ringbuffer sizes="1024,100,250"
[00:18:49] <erDiZz> SWPLinux, consider this: you feed back by the ring buffer first, but then you want more, and expect the interpreter to push more data
[00:19:00] <erDiZz> so you have to tell the interpreter where to start from
[00:19:08] <erDiZz> that's how it is involved
[00:19:39] <erDiZz> lerman, it's configurable. the limit is the amount of RAM
[00:19:44] <SWPLinux> you'd probably want to set the adaptive feed override to 0, to pause the trajectory planner until you're done backing up and getting back to where you were
[00:19:53] <lerman> You could buffer the commands to canon.
[00:20:05] <lerman> And play them backwards.
[00:20:13] <SWPLinux> when you're getting close to the stopping point, un-zero the adaptive feed override pin
[00:20:27] <fenn> SWPadnos: you could just always run from the hal buffer and just move back and forth in the hal buffer to determine the spark gap
[00:20:42] <SWPLinux> lerman: that doesn't quite work - I think things like G41/G42 and other modal settings can screw it up
[00:20:58] <SWPLinux> fenn: yes, though you need to tell the TP where you are, or get following errors
[00:20:58] <erDiZz> the way I'm going to do that, the buffer will be getting filled by the interpreter even while there is data in the ring buffer still
[00:21:22] <erDiZz> one doesn't want the delays
[00:21:24] <lerman> You would have to keep modal state info as well as commands.
[00:21:24] <SWPLinux> sure, but a ring buffer by definition is almost always full. if you need to back up, you also need to stop putting things in it
[00:21:49] <SWPLinux> (almost because it's not full at program start, or when you've backed up)
[00:21:57] <erDiZz> two ring buffers will do
[00:22:10] <erDiZz> it's not that hard, just switch the buffers at the right time
[00:22:27] <erDiZz> the goal is to _always_ have some data at the buffer
[00:22:41] <erDiZz> it shoudn't ever get empty until the program is completed
[00:23:30] <lerman> As far as I'm concerned, it is a canon design bug that canon needs to keep track of state. I consider stateful interfaces to be bad (in general).
[00:24:03] <CIA-8> 03fjungclaus 07TRUNK * 10emc2/share/axis/tcl/axis.tcl: Additional changes for history-cycling work on axis.py
[00:24:13] <lerman> (Although at the time it was written, it might have been considered too expensive to transfer the state all the time.)
[00:24:30] <SWPLinux> I'm not positive that canon is stateful, but I know state is an issue for generic "full program reversal"
[00:24:51] <SWPLinux> that requires re-parsing of G-code, which is stateful
[00:25:11] <lerman> I read the code of canon recently. As I recall, there were even some functions to read the state from canon.
[00:25:53] <lerman> G-code is stateful. An that is appropriate. After all, it does need to know the current position.
[00:26:05] <erDiZz> mm
[00:26:13] <erDiZz> is G-code reversible in general"
[00:26:12] <erDiZz> ?
[00:26:22] <lerman> And I don't really object to canon knowing what the current position is.
[00:26:25] <erDiZz> are there loops or smth?
[00:26:29] <SWPLinux> yeah, and current tool length, and current offset mode, and current tool radius, and current compensation mode, and current plane .......
[00:26:41] <SWPLinux> erDiZz: yes, look on the wiki for "owords"
[00:26:46] <lerman> G-code is NOT reversible. And yes, there are loops, subroutines, etc.
[00:27:12] <SWPLinux> lerman: it is, if you're careful
[00:27:20] <erDiZz> ok, so you can't do this with G-code, but one can translate the program into something linear that could be parsed in both directions
[00:27:25] <SWPLinux> for example, G41 reversed is G42
[00:27:38] <erDiZz> as I understand, N gagabytes program is a linear one
[00:27:44] <SWPLinux> (but of course I chose an easy example ;) )
[00:28:15] <jepler> I don't think you want to reverse the execution of the g-code program -- you want to reverse the path of motion that it defines
[00:28:27] <lerman> But as you scan backwards, if you set a state, you don't know what the previous state is. To make the interp run backwards, it would require saving some state.
[00:28:34] <jepler> I mean, I don't think that reversing the execution of the g-code program (with loops & all) is the right approach
[00:28:36] <SWPLinux> yes
[00:28:42] <erDiZz> lerman, it's like XML: <state>foobar</state>
[00:28:42] <erDiZz> so I know
[00:28:44] <jmkasunich> arghh.... that tuxcnc page pisses me off
[00:28:58] <SWPLinux> yeah, it's pretty annoying, isn't it
[00:29:08] <lerman> So, I set incremental mode in the g-code. How do I reverse that? The previous state might also have been incremental mode.
[00:29:11] <jmkasunich> that list line is a flat out lie
[00:29:12] <erDiZz> jepler, if the programs is large enough than it's not trivial without reversing
[00:29:27] <jmkasunich> he knows darn well that we are continuing development, if anything at a faster pace than ever
[00:29:43] <SWPLinux> yeah, and with 4x as many developers ...
[00:29:55] <SWPLinux> (maybe more, if you count people like me :) )
[00:30:13] <jmkasunich> we shut down the sourceforge repo because it was unreliable and was slowing us down - we have a better repository now
[00:33:01] <erDiZz> lerman, it'll be specified as well: <incr>before<incr>now</incr></incr>
[00:33:18] <erDiZz> and it is not necessary to keep nested structures while parsing
[00:33:41] <erDiZz> slashed tags are being parsed while gowing backwards, non-slashed - while going forwards
[00:34:07] <erDiZz> keeping track of nested states will be needed only during translating from G-code into this thought format
[00:35:00] <SWPLinux> the other option is to have a stack for saving "old" states. if you're going backwards and see a G55, pop the old state instead of setting that one
[00:35:17] <SWPLinux> optionally, just stick G-codes on the stack that would restore you to the current state
[00:35:47] <fjungclaus__> fjungclaus__ is now known as fjungclaus-away
[00:35:56] <lerman> How many state variables are there?
[00:36:08] <erDiZz> SWPLinux, and if I have G91 on each line then I'm out of stack space eventually?
[00:36:38] <erDiZz> that's those undesirable nested states
[00:36:42] <lerman> I suspect that there are few enough that at each line, we could just write a state record to a file.
[00:37:27] <erDiZz> writing to a file is a potential disk I/O
[00:37:42] <erDiZz> and thus it could take several seconds to complete
[00:38:16] <lerman> Yup. But my disk is a lot faster than my servo. Not seconds, though. Remember that linux buffers disk I/O very well.
[00:38:23] <SWPLinux> for EDM, several seconds per line is no problem
[00:38:52] <erDiZz> but the disk itself is
[00:38:59] <erDiZz> I'm not going to have one :
[00:39:00] <erDiZz> :)
[00:39:03] <SWPLinux> heh
[00:39:07] <SWPLinux> buffer to RAMdisk ;)
[00:39:24] <lerman> Where does your gcode come from if not disk?
[00:39:26] <erDiZz> so we're back again: out of RAM == out of stack
[00:39:34] <SWPLinux> sure
[00:40:00] <erDiZz> lerman, 128Mb flash could do
[00:40:33] <SWPLinux> if you start with G-code on a 128M flash, then you can't need more than that for saving state data
[00:40:38] <erDiZz> I was counting on that while rolling an LFS distro
[00:40:42] <lerman> I just bought some 1Gig usb flash memory for $15 each.
[00:40:51] <SWPLinux> unless your Gocde consists entirely of state changes, wih no useful motion
[00:41:01] <SWPLinux> lerman: micro center?
[00:41:18] <SWPLinux> I keep getting ads from them for 1G @$15 or 2G @ $19
[00:41:22] <erDiZz> lerman, flash has limited rewrites, so it's more like ROM
[00:41:30] <lerman> No. What's the name of the place... competes with staples.
[00:41:39] <SWPLinux> OfficeMax
[00:42:07] <lerman> About 10K rewrites per block. And built in load leveling. (yes office max)
[00:42:53] <SWPLinux> erDiZz: note that your interim format doesn't actually save the previous state, the </incr> tags have no information about what was there before
[00:43:11] <erDiZz> they have
[00:43:12] <SWPLinux> and you might go out of incremental mode on encountering the first one, which is incorrect behavior
[00:43:28] <erDiZz> reading them backwards is exactly like reading forwards
[00:43:33] <erDiZz> they're ALL mirrored
[00:43:40] <lerman> That's an expensive format in terms of bytes.
[00:43:48] <jepler> fwiw TC_STRUCT, the structure that holds one "motion" (including its permitted accel & vel) is 316 bytes (one g0/g1/g2/g3/g33)
[00:43:51] <erDiZz> it's only twice as expensive
[00:44:01] <SWPLinux> no, because the opposite of <INCR> is <whatever the state was before>, not </INCR>
[00:44:05] <lerman> If I had only 128meg, I'd be more conservative.
[00:44:13] <erDiZz> SWPLinux, nono
[00:44:45] <erDiZz> you see: it was A, then it became B, so it'll look like A B /B /A
[00:44:59] <erDiZz> and when reading backwards I know that it was "A" before I switch to B
[00:45:01] <jmkasunich> what if it was A, and the program called for A again?
[00:45:22] <erDiZz> then it'll be A A /A /A
[00:45:25] <erDiZz> it's still ok
[00:45:38] <lerman> Technically, you wouldn't have to record that. Just record the changes.
[00:46:08] <jmkasunich> so if somebody writes A A A A A A A B B A B B A B A B A B A A A A A B B A B A you will have to add the entire sequence backwards onto the end?
[00:46:08] <SWPLinux> ok - you're right. I was looking at it wrong because you happened to have two of the same tag
[00:46:10] <erDiZz> yeah, that's possible as we do translation first and can check the sanity
[00:46:27] <erDiZz> jmkasunich, yes, it's twice the size
[01:08:47] <A-L-P-H-A> SWPadnos... me mesa im me mands.
[01:08:56] <A-L-P-H-A> A A A A A A A B B A B B A B A B A B A A A A A B B A B A
[01:11:08] <SWPLinux> yay
[01:11:30] <A-L-P-H-A> also some dark chocolate... 70% cocoa
[01:11:47] <SWPLinux> yay
[01:16:18] <A-L-P-H-A> oooh smart... they put a slot for the ribbons too!!!
[01:16:41] <SWPLinux> yep. 3 ribbons do fit through the slot cover
[01:17:34] <A-L-P-H-A> okay... I got a q... what's the two big chunky things in the middle left, of the 7137?
[01:17:41] <A-L-P-H-A> V|TEC things
[01:18:14] <A-L-P-H-A> and the array of 8 3055... what's a 3055
[01:18:19] <A-L-P-H-A> google away!
[01:18:41] <A-L-P-H-A> oh power transistors.
[01:19:19] <SWPLinux> the two vitec things are transformers
[01:19:57] <A-L-P-H-A> and the 4 NEC things are iso-optos?
[01:21:15] <A-L-P-H-A> anyways... these are actually reallly nicely made boards...
[01:21:21] <A-L-P-H-A> this is sad... I'm a little sad.
[01:21:31] <A-L-P-H-A> these boards, cost more than my video cards. :(
[01:22:39] <erDiZz> need rest...
[01:22:44] <SWPLinux> look on the bright side. they didn't cost more than my video cards :)
[01:22:44] <erDiZz> bye all
[01:22:44] <tomp_> erDiZz: are you from the myNC group?
[01:22:45] <SWPLinux> see you
[01:22:53] <erDiZz> tomp_, I am
[01:23:08] <erDiZz> you could ask me later
[01:23:09] <tomp_> talk to youwhen you come back, i specialize in edm
[01:23:15] <erDiZz> ok
[01:23:55] <fjungclaus__> fjungclaus__ is now known as fjungclaus
[01:23:57] <tomp_> crap, i just noticed all that buzz about edm
[02:21:26] <SWPLinux> interesting
[02:23:46] <SWPadnos> alex_joni, I had to change the script to use chat.freenode.net instead of irc.freenode.net to get the loggers to start
[02:24:30] <SWPadnos> alex_joni, or at least, after multiple failed attempts to start them, they worked after I did that
[02:25:34] <CIA-8> 03cradek 07v2_1_branch * 10emc2/nc_files/g76.ngc: threading cycle for inside threads too, which changes the g76 syntax again; trying to keep it as sane and logical as possible.
[02:25:36] <CIA-8> 03cradek 07v2_1_branch * 10emc2/src/emc/rs274ngc/interp_convert.cc: threading cycle for inside threads too, which changes the g76 syntax again; trying to keep it as sane and logical as possible.
[02:36:11] <Nicolas35LA> Hi all, is there a text mode (command line or other) utility to send mdi commands?
[02:36:18] <Nicolas35LA> for EMC2
[02:41:23] <fenn> "jdi.py" does something like that
[02:41:39] <Nicolas35LA> thank you
[02:41:47] <Nicolas35LA> mdi I suppose?
[02:41:57] <Nicolas35LA> mdi.py
[02:42:26] <fenn> http://axis.unpy.net/01167419757
[02:43:31] <fenn> it might cause problems because it goes into estop at the end of every line
[02:43:43] <Nicolas35LA> ok
[02:43:46] <fenn> so, just remove the c.state(emc.STATE_ESTOP)
[02:43:49] <Nicolas35LA> I will look at the code
[02:43:57] <Nicolas35LA> thank you
[02:45:12] <fenn> ah here we go
[02:45:13] <fenn> AXIS includes a program called ``mdi'' which allows text-mode entry of MDI commands to a running emc session. You can run this program by opening a terminal and typing
[02:45:13] <fenn> mdi /path/to/emc.nml
[02:45:26] <cradek> jdi runs an entire file, mdi runs one command
[02:47:53] <Nicolas35LA> great
[02:48:28] <cradek> they're both useful as-is but were primarily written to show the simple python interface to EMC
[02:48:42] <Nicolas35LA> exactly what I was looking for actually
[02:48:51] <cradek> great
[02:56:00] <fenn> is emc.stat() where axis gets the data for the backplot?
[02:56:13] <cradek> yes
[02:56:24] <cradek> and many other things
[03:59:37] <CIA-8> 03jepler 07v2_1_branch * 10emc2/docs/src/gcode/main.lyx: start on g76 documentaton
[03:59:51] <jepler> good night everyone
[04:00:20] <skunkworks> Night jepler
[04:12:01] <SWPadnos_> SWPadnos_ is now known as SWPadnos
[05:28:35] <Jymmmm> SWPadnos: The 400 disc DVD player isn't IDE =(
[05:38:56] <CIA-8> 03jmkasunich 07v2_1_branch * 10emc2/docs/src/gcode/main.lyx: minor tweaks to G76 docs
[05:39:10] <jmkasunich> goodnight all
[07:08:59] <ds3> hmmm
[07:27:43] <K`zan> Night all
[08:05:51] <alex_joni> SWPadnos: yeah, but that means they log to a different folder now, and that's no good
[09:57:56] <slundell> How far away is the 2.1 release?
[10:06:48] <alex_joni> days
[10:08:33] <slundell> ok, so I the CVS version is quite close to the final 2.1?
[10:08:53] <slundell> -I
[10:22:19] <alex_joni> slundell: the one on the v2-1_branch
[10:22:34] <alex_joni> slundell: the one on the v2_1_branch
[10:23:01] <alex_joni> http://cvs.linuxcnc.org/cgi-bin/cvsweb.cgi/emc2/?only_with_tag=v2_1_branch
[10:23:39] <slundell> ok. So the when i go from v2_1_branch to the upcoming 2.1 there will not be a great deal of changes?
[10:24:11] <alex_joni> not really
[10:24:21] <alex_joni> you can also install some prerelease deb if you like
[10:24:35] <alex_joni> I mean if you don't like to waste time on compiling it yourself
[10:25:02] <alex_joni> http://wiki.linuxcnc.org/cgi-bin/emcinfo.pl?Emc2.1.0
[10:35:38] <alex_joni> bbl..
[11:17:52] <anonimasu> hello aw
[11:18:17] <Dallur> hey anonimasu
[11:18:23] <anonimasu> hello dallur
[11:19:32] <Dallur> anonimasu: man I will be glad when I am done with this object model, I woke up in the middle of the night wondering if sleep was a singleton class :P
[11:29:38] <anonimasu> :/
[11:29:40] <anonimasu> that's bad
[11:30:22] <Dallur> anonimasu: don't worry, it is :D
[11:31:56] <anonimasu> my spamfilter eats stuff today
[11:32:25] <anonimasu> ^_^
[12:51:14] <awallin> I'd like to get the wxpython GUI + vtk rendering window thing going this weekend. since I got some Z-slicing algorithm from Julian to try out...
[12:51:28] <awallin> anonimasu: have you looked at that at all?
[12:56:12] <anonimasu> awallin: jepler has something that works.
[12:56:19] <anonimasu> awallin: he owned both me and fenn..
[12:56:21] <anonimasu> :D
[12:57:50] <awallin> yeah, I saw the cutting simulation, looked nice.
[12:58:48] <anonimasu> havent worked any more on it
[12:58:49] <anonimasu> vtk is way too slow
[13:00:42] <awallin> Iäm a bit surprised if it really is too slow.
[13:01:10] <awallin> I think the calculations need to be in C/C++, but the visualization could be in python/vtk
[13:08:07] <anonimasu> it ends up being slow :/
[13:08:14] <anonimasu> as ir creates a actor per matchstick..
[13:12:53] <awallin> that needs to be done smarter then...
[13:14:22] <alex_joni> hi guys
[13:14:25] <alex_joni> how goes it?
[13:16:40] <awallin> snow and windy over here
[13:17:08] <awallin> like so http://virtual.finland.fi/netcomm/news/showarticle.asp?intNWSAID=27690
[13:25:01] <alex_joni> brrr.. looks cold
[13:40:19] <A-L-P-H-A> alex_joni, is the emc non-realtime just the simulator, or is it going the mesa route?
[13:44:43] <jepler> A-L-P-H-A: non-realtime is not capable of controlling any hardware.
[13:45:18] <A-L-P-H-A> jepler. okie. wasn't sure what the non-realtime branch was doing... I knew simulating... but wasn't sure if twas limited to just that
[13:46:07] <jepler> A-L-P-H-A: yes: for users, the point of non-realtime is to do things like preview and simulate g-code. for developers, another point of non-realtime is easier debugging and development of everything besides the hardware drivers
[13:46:18] <A-L-P-H-A> I'm under the impression that the mesa, is just a pulse generator... simular to g-rex. Will I be passing it the gcode, or emc handles the gcode, and sends the pulse generating commands to the mesa? or passing gcodes to the mesa, and mesa handles everything afterwards?
[13:46:35] <A-L-P-H-A> jepler. okie.
[13:48:02] <alex_joni> A-L-P-H-A: the mesa as it is now takes some analog dac's values, and sets those
[13:48:09] <alex_joni> it also counts encoders
[13:48:17] <alex_joni> and emc2 does the PID & corrections & all
[13:48:21] <alex_joni> that needs realtime
[13:48:48] <A-L-P-H-A> I'm jus trying to visualize what does what atm.
[13:49:07] <alex_joni> I suspect a full intepreter like thing won't fit inside the mesa
[13:50:14] <alex_joni> bbl
[13:50:19] <A-L-P-H-A> lates
[13:50:55] <awallin> the mesa has pwm generators, and encoder counters
[13:51:14] <awallin> emc reads the value of the encoder counter, and commands the pwm generator to generate pwm at a certain rate
[13:51:15] <A-L-P-H-A> I'm gonna draw this out... as I'm sure others may have the same Qs.
[13:51:54] <awallin> A-L-P-H-A: if you look at the mesa website, they do have a SoftDMC config, which includes trajectory generation etc, but that config is not used with emc
[13:57:32] <jepler> A-L-P-H-A: the HAL pins, parameters, and functions of the 5i20 card as used by emc2 are shown in the manal, http://linuxcnc.org/docs/2.1/HAL_User_Manual.pdf PDF page 58-63
[13:57:53] <A-L-P-H-A> checking
[13:58:13] <jepler> er document page 58-63
[14:11:36] <lerman> I was just looking at these pages. On page 60, it describes "(U16) m5i20.<board>.watchdog-control – Configures the watchdog." It then refers to Bit 1 and Bit 16. Do we really number bits starting at one rather than at zero? The data types shown on page 11 include U32, but not U16. Is this a bug? Or am I missing something?
[14:20:12] <anonimasu> lerman: _if_ a german wrote it it can be either way :D
[14:21:06] <lerman> And would the bit start counting at the MSB or LSB? (Or in the middle?)
[14:55:47] <jepler> lerman: historically there was a "U16" HAL type, but it was removed during the 2.1 development cycle. I guess it wasn't fixed in all the documentation.
[14:56:28] <jepler> lerman: I'm sure that "bit 1" refers to the bit with weight 0x1 and "bit 16" refers to the bit with weight 0x8000
[14:58:53] <lerman> That's what I assume. But out of context, if I just saw a reference to bit 1, I would think it was weight 0x2. The fact that there was a bit 16 clued me in. There should be something explicit. And there should be a standard defined in the document. I would suggest that bit 0 through bit 15 would be "more standard".
[15:03:31] <jepler> actually .. it's the heading "bit" which is misleading
[15:03:57] <jepler> "Typically, the useful values are 0 (watchdog disabled) or 20 (8ms watchdog enabled, cleared by dac-write)"
[15:04:12] <jepler> 20 = 4 + 16
[15:04:29] <lerman> Correct.
[15:11:05] <jepler> worse yet that's the 'motenc' card's watchdog documentation -- m5i20's documentation is different
[15:12:08] <lerman> I'm very impressed by that manual. (And by the underlying product).
[15:12:51] <jepler> A lot of work has gone into the manual, but it is far from perfect
[15:13:02] <lerman> --although I've yet to use HAL. I'm still using EMC1. (Well, it was just EMC when I started to use it.)
[15:13:48] <lerman> Reminds me of a product I used called "Final Word". ... and then they revised it to be "Final Word II" if that makes sense.
[15:14:41] <CIA-8> 03jepler 07v2_1_branch * 10emc2/docs/src/hal/drivers.lyx: fix and clarify watchdog-control documentation for m5i20 and motenc. change pin types to u32
[15:15:11] <jepler> hah
[15:15:12] <CIA-8> 03jepler 07v2_1_branch * 10emc2/docs/src/gui/halui.lyx: update documentation to match the implementation
[15:15:30] <CIA-8> 03jepler 07v2_1_branch * 10emc2/docs/src/gui/halui.lyx: update documentation to match the implementation
[15:17:28] <CIA-8> 03jepler 07v2_1_branch * 10emc2/docs/src/hal/tutorial.lyx: update documentation to match the implementation
[15:20:17] <CIA-8> 03jepler 07TRUNK * 10emc2/docs/src/hal/ (drivers.lyx tutorial.lyx): merge from v2_1_branch: update documentation to match the implementation. fix watchdog documentation for m5i20 and motenc
[15:20:52] <CIA-8> 03jepler 07TRUNK * 10emc2/docs/src/gui/halui.lyx: merge from v2_1_branch: update documentation to match the implementation
[15:29:16] <CIA-8> 03jepler 07v2_1_branch * 10emc2/docs/src/Submakefile: include all section1 manpages in html index
[15:29:27] <CIA-8> 03jepler 07v2_1_branch * 10emc2/docs/src/index.tmpl: include new lyx documentation sections
[15:30:24] <rayh> so that's where it is.
[15:33:04] <CIA-8> 03jepler 07TRUNK * 10emc2/docs/src/Submakefile: merge rev 1.28.2.6: include all section1 manpages in html index
[15:34:03] <CIA-8> 03cradek 07v2_1_branch * 10emc2/docs/src/gcode/main.lyx:
[15:34:03] <CIA-8> a few clarifications and typo fixes, plus avoidance of the word "start"
[15:34:03] <CIA-8> which has a special meaning when talking about threads
[16:03:22] <CIA-8> 03cradek 07v2_1_branch * 10emc2/docs/src/gcode/main.lyx: stupid whitespace fix
[16:10:16] <CIA-8> 03cradek 07v2_1_branch * 10emc2/docs/src/gcode/main.lyx: typo fix and clarification
[16:24:27] <awallin> ?
[16:25:06] <alex_joni> !
[16:25:32] <Dallur> .
[02:21:26] <SWPLinux> interesting
[02:23:46] <SWPadnos> alex_joni, I had to change the script to use chat.freenode.net instead of irc.freenode.net to get the loggers to start
[02:24:30] <SWPadnos> alex_joni, or at least, after multiple failed attempts to start them, they worked after I did that
[02:25:34] <CIA-8> 03cradek 07v2_1_branch * 10emc2/nc_files/g76.ngc: threading cycle for inside threads too, which changes the g76 syntax again; trying to keep it as sane and logical as possible.
[02:25:36] <CIA-8> 03cradek 07v2_1_branch * 10emc2/src/emc/rs274ngc/interp_convert.cc: threading cycle for inside threads too, which changes the g76 syntax again; trying to keep it as sane and logical as possible.
[02:36:11] <Nicolas35LA> Hi all, is there a text mode (command line or other) utility to send mdi commands?
[02:36:18] <Nicolas35LA> for EMC2
[02:41:23] <fenn> "jdi.py" does something like that
[02:41:39] <Nicolas35LA> thank you
[02:41:47] <Nicolas35LA> mdi I suppose?
[02:41:57] <Nicolas35LA> mdi.py
[02:42:26] <fenn> http://axis.unpy.net/01167419757
[02:43:31] <fenn> it might cause problems because it goes into estop at the end of every line
[02:43:43] <Nicolas35LA> ok
[02:43:46] <fenn> so, just remove the c.state(emc.STATE_ESTOP)
[02:43:49] <Nicolas35LA> I will look at the code
[02:43:57] <Nicolas35LA> thank you
[02:45:12] <fenn> ah here we go
[02:45:13] <fenn> AXIS includes a program called ``mdi'' which allows text-mode entry of MDI commands to a running emc session. You can run this program by opening a terminal and typing
[02:45:13] <fenn> mdi /path/to/emc.nml
[02:45:26] <cradek> jdi runs an entire file, mdi runs one command
[02:47:53] <Nicolas35LA> great
[02:48:28] <cradek> they're both useful as-is but were primarily written to show the simple python interface to EMC
[02:48:42] <Nicolas35LA> exactly what I was looking for actually
[02:48:51] <cradek> great
[02:56:00] <fenn> is emc.stat() where axis gets the data for the backplot?
[02:56:13] <cradek> yes
[02:56:24] <cradek> and many other things
[03:59:37] <CIA-8> 03jepler 07v2_1_branch * 10emc2/docs/src/gcode/main.lyx: start on g76 documentaton
[03:59:51] <jepler> good night everyone
[04:00:20] <skunkworks> Night jepler
[04:12:01] <SWPadnos_> SWPadnos_ is now known as SWPadnos
[05:28:35] <Jymmmm> SWPadnos: The 400 disc DVD player isn't IDE =(
[05:38:56] <CIA-8> 03jmkasunich 07v2_1_branch * 10emc2/docs/src/gcode/main.lyx: minor tweaks to G76 docs
[05:39:10] <jmkasunich> goodnight all
[07:08:59] <ds3> hmmm
[07:27:43] <K`zan> Night all
[08:05:51] <alex_joni> SWPadnos: yeah, but that means they log to a different folder now, and that's no good
[09:57:56] <slundell> How far away is the 2.1 release?
[10:06:48] <alex_joni> days
[10:08:33] <slundell> ok, so I the CVS version is quite close to the final 2.1?
[10:08:53] <slundell> -I
[10:22:19] <alex_joni> slundell: the one on the v2-1_branch
[10:22:34] <alex_joni> slundell: the one on the v2_1_branch
[10:23:01] <alex_joni> http://cvs.linuxcnc.org/cgi-bin/cvsweb.cgi/emc2/?only_with_tag=v2_1_branch
[10:23:39] <slundell> ok. So the when i go from v2_1_branch to the upcoming 2.1 there will not be a great deal of changes?
[10:24:11] <alex_joni> not really
[10:24:21] <alex_joni> you can also install some prerelease deb if you like
[10:24:35] <alex_joni> I mean if you don't like to waste time on compiling it yourself
[10:25:02] <alex_joni> http://wiki.linuxcnc.org/cgi-bin/emcinfo.pl?Emc2.1.0
[10:35:38] <alex_joni> bbl..
[11:17:52] <anonimasu> hello aw
[11:18:17] <Dallur> hey anonimasu
[11:18:23] <anonimasu> hello dallur
[11:19:32] <Dallur> anonimasu: man I will be glad when I am done with this object model, I woke up in the middle of the night wondering if sleep was a singleton class :P
[11:29:38] <anonimasu> :/
[11:29:40] <anonimasu> that's bad
[11:30:22] <Dallur> anonimasu: don't worry, it is :D
[11:31:56] <anonimasu> my spamfilter eats stuff today
[11:32:25] <anonimasu> ^_^
[12:51:14] <awallin> I'd like to get the wxpython GUI + vtk rendering window thing going this weekend. since I got some Z-slicing algorithm from Julian to try out...
[12:51:28] <awallin> anonimasu: have you looked at that at all?
[12:56:12] <anonimasu> awallin: jepler has something that works.
[12:56:19] <anonimasu> awallin: he owned both me and fenn..
[12:56:21] <anonimasu> :D
[12:57:50] <awallin> yeah, I saw the cutting simulation, looked nice.
[12:58:48] <anonimasu> havent worked any more on it
[12:58:49] <anonimasu> vtk is way too slow
[13:00:42] <awallin> Iäm a bit surprised if it really is too slow.
[13:01:10] <awallin> I think the calculations need to be in C/C++, but the visualization could be in python/vtk
[13:08:07] <anonimasu> it ends up being slow :/
[13:08:14] <anonimasu> as ir creates a actor per matchstick..
[13:12:53] <awallin> that needs to be done smarter then...
[13:14:22] <alex_joni> hi guys
[13:14:25] <alex_joni> how goes it?
[13:16:40] <awallin> snow and windy over here
[13:17:08] <awallin> like so http://virtual.finland.fi/netcomm/news/showarticle.asp?intNWSAID=27690
[13:25:01] <alex_joni> brrr.. looks cold
[13:40:19] <A-L-P-H-A> alex_joni, is the emc non-realtime just the simulator, or is it going the mesa route?
[13:44:43] <jepler> A-L-P-H-A: non-realtime is not capable of controlling any hardware.
[13:45:18] <A-L-P-H-A> jepler. okie. wasn't sure what the non-realtime branch was doing... I knew simulating... but wasn't sure if twas limited to just that
[13:46:07] <jepler> A-L-P-H-A: yes: for users, the point of non-realtime is to do things like preview and simulate g-code. for developers, another point of non-realtime is easier debugging and development of everything besides the hardware drivers
[13:46:18] <A-L-P-H-A> I'm under the impression that the mesa, is just a pulse generator... simular to g-rex. Will I be passing it the gcode, or emc handles the gcode, and sends the pulse generating commands to the mesa? or passing gcodes to the mesa, and mesa handles everything afterwards?
[13:46:35] <A-L-P-H-A> jepler. okie.
[13:48:02] <alex_joni> A-L-P-H-A: the mesa as it is now takes some analog dac's values, and sets those
[13:48:09] <alex_joni> it also counts encoders
[13:48:17] <alex_joni> and emc2 does the PID & corrections & all
[13:48:21] <alex_joni> that needs realtime
[13:48:48] <A-L-P-H-A> I'm jus trying to visualize what does what atm.
[13:49:07] <alex_joni> I suspect a full intepreter like thing won't fit inside the mesa
[13:50:14] <alex_joni> bbl
[13:50:19] <A-L-P-H-A> lates
[13:50:55] <awallin> the mesa has pwm generators, and encoder counters
[13:51:14] <awallin> emc reads the value of the encoder counter, and commands the pwm generator to generate pwm at a certain rate
[13:51:15] <A-L-P-H-A> I'm gonna draw this out... as I'm sure others may have the same Qs.
[13:51:54] <awallin> A-L-P-H-A: if you look at the mesa website, they do have a SoftDMC config, which includes trajectory generation etc, but that config is not used with emc
[13:57:32] <jepler> A-L-P-H-A: the HAL pins, parameters, and functions of the 5i20 card as used by emc2 are shown in the manal, http://linuxcnc.org/docs/2.1/HAL_User_Manual.pdf PDF page 58-63
[13:57:53] <A-L-P-H-A> checking
[13:58:13] <jepler> er document page 58-63
[14:11:36] <lerman> I was just looking at these pages. On page 60, it describes "(U16) m5i20.<board>.watchdog-control – Configures the watchdog." It then refers to Bit 1 and Bit 16. Do we really number bits starting at one rather than at zero? The data types shown on page 11 include U32, but not U16. Is this a bug? Or am I missing something?
[14:20:12] <anonimasu> lerman: _if_ a german wrote it it can be either way :D
[14:21:06] <lerman> And would the bit start counting at the MSB or LSB? (Or in the middle?)
[14:55:47] <jepler> lerman: historically there was a "U16" HAL type, but it was removed during the 2.1 development cycle. I guess it wasn't fixed in all the documentation.
[14:56:28] <jepler> lerman: I'm sure that "bit 1" refers to the bit with weight 0x1 and "bit 16" refers to the bit with weight 0x8000
[14:58:53] <lerman> That's what I assume. But out of context, if I just saw a reference to bit 1, I would think it was weight 0x2. The fact that there was a bit 16 clued me in. There should be something explicit. And there should be a standard defined in the document. I would suggest that bit 0 through bit 15 would be "more standard".
[15:03:31] <jepler> actually .. it's the heading "bit" which is misleading
[15:03:57] <jepler> "Typically, the useful values are 0 (watchdog disabled) or 20 (8ms watchdog enabled, cleared by dac-write)"
[15:04:12] <jepler> 20 = 4 + 16
[15:04:29] <lerman> Correct.
[15:11:05] <jepler> worse yet that's the 'motenc' card's watchdog documentation -- m5i20's documentation is different
[15:12:08] <lerman> I'm very impressed by that manual. (And by the underlying product).
[15:12:51] <jepler> A lot of work has gone into the manual, but it is far from perfect
[15:13:02] <lerman> --although I've yet to use HAL. I'm still using EMC1. (Well, it was just EMC when I started to use it.)
[15:13:48] <lerman> Reminds me of a product I used called "Final Word". ... and then they revised it to be "Final Word II" if that makes sense.
[15:14:41] <CIA-8> 03jepler 07v2_1_branch * 10emc2/docs/src/hal/drivers.lyx: fix and clarify watchdog-control documentation for m5i20 and motenc. change pin types to u32
[15:15:11] <jepler> hah
[15:15:12] <CIA-8> 03jepler 07v2_1_branch * 10emc2/docs/src/gui/halui.lyx: update documentation to match the implementation
[15:15:30] <CIA-8> 03jepler 07v2_1_branch * 10emc2/docs/src/gui/halui.lyx: update documentation to match the implementation
[15:17:28] <CIA-8> 03jepler 07v2_1_branch * 10emc2/docs/src/hal/tutorial.lyx: update documentation to match the implementation
[15:20:17] <CIA-8> 03jepler 07TRUNK * 10emc2/docs/src/hal/ (drivers.lyx tutorial.lyx): merge from v2_1_branch: update documentation to match the implementation. fix watchdog documentation for m5i20 and motenc
[15:20:52] <CIA-8> 03jepler 07TRUNK * 10emc2/docs/src/gui/halui.lyx: merge from v2_1_branch: update documentation to match the implementation
[15:29:16] <CIA-8> 03jepler 07v2_1_branch * 10emc2/docs/src/Submakefile: include all section1 manpages in html index
[15:29:27] <CIA-8> 03jepler 07v2_1_branch * 10emc2/docs/src/index.tmpl: include new lyx documentation sections
[15:30:24] <rayh> so that's where it is.
[15:33:04] <CIA-8> 03jepler 07TRUNK * 10emc2/docs/src/Submakefile: merge rev 1.28.2.6: include all section1 manpages in html index
[15:34:03] <CIA-8> 03cradek 07v2_1_branch * 10emc2/docs/src/gcode/main.lyx:
[15:34:03] <CIA-8> a few clarifications and typo fixes, plus avoidance of the word "start"
[15:34:03] <CIA-8> which has a special meaning when talking about threads
[16:03:22] <CIA-8> 03cradek 07v2_1_branch * 10emc2/docs/src/gcode/main.lyx: stupid whitespace fix
[16:10:16] <CIA-8> 03cradek 07v2_1_branch * 10emc2/docs/src/gcode/main.lyx: typo fix and clarification
[16:24:27] <awallin> ?
[16:25:06] <alex_joni> !
[16:25:32] <Dallur> .
[02:21:26] <SWPLinux> interesting
[02:23:46] <SWPadnos> alex_joni, I had to change the script to use chat.freenode.net instead of irc.freenode.net to get the loggers to start
[02:24:30] <SWPadnos> alex_joni, or at least, after multiple failed attempts to start them, they worked after I did that
[02:25:34] <CIA-8> 03cradek 07v2_1_branch * 10emc2/nc_files/g76.ngc: threading cycle for inside threads too, which changes the g76 syntax again; trying to keep it as sane and logical as possible.
[02:25:36] <CIA-8> 03cradek 07v2_1_branch * 10emc2/src/emc/rs274ngc/interp_convert.cc: threading cycle for inside threads too, which changes the g76 syntax again; trying to keep it as sane and logical as possible.
[02:36:11] <Nicolas35LA> Hi all, is there a text mode (command line or other) utility to send mdi commands?
[02:36:18] <Nicolas35LA> for EMC2
[02:41:23] <fenn> "jdi.py" does something like that
[02:41:39] <Nicolas35LA> thank you
[02:41:47] <Nicolas35LA> mdi I suppose?
[02:41:57] <Nicolas35LA> mdi.py
[02:42:26] <fenn> http://axis.unpy.net/01167419757
[02:43:31] <fenn> it might cause problems because it goes into estop at the end of every line
[02:43:43] <Nicolas35LA> ok
[02:43:46] <fenn> so, just remove the c.state(emc.STATE_ESTOP)
[02:43:49] <Nicolas35LA> I will look at the code
[02:43:57] <Nicolas35LA> thank you
[02:45:12] <fenn> ah here we go
[02:45:13] <fenn> AXIS includes a program called ``mdi'' which allows text-mode entry of MDI commands to a running emc session. You can run this program by opening a terminal and typing
[02:45:13] <fenn> mdi /path/to/emc.nml
[02:45:26] <cradek> jdi runs an entire file, mdi runs one command
[02:47:53] <Nicolas35LA> great
[02:48:28] <cradek> they're both useful as-is but were primarily written to show the simple python interface to EMC
[02:48:42] <Nicolas35LA> exactly what I was looking for actually
[02:48:51] <cradek> great
[02:56:00] <fenn> is emc.stat() where axis gets the data for the backplot?
[02:56:13] <cradek> yes
[02:56:24] <cradek> and many other things
[03:59:37] <CIA-8> 03jepler 07v2_1_branch * 10emc2/docs/src/gcode/main.lyx: start on g76 documentaton
[03:59:51] <jepler> good night everyone
[04:00:20] <skunkworks> Night jepler
[04:12:01] <SWPadnos_> SWPadnos_ is now known as SWPadnos
[05:28:35] <Jymmmm> SWPadnos: The 400 disc DVD player isn't IDE =(
[05:38:56] <CIA-8> 03jmkasunich 07v2_1_branch * 10emc2/docs/src/gcode/main.lyx: minor tweaks to G76 docs
[05:39:10] <jmkasunich> goodnight all
[07:08:59] <ds3> hmmm
[07:27:43] <K`zan> Night all
[08:05:51] <alex_joni> SWPadnos: yeah, but that means they log to a different folder now, and that's no good
[09:57:56] <slundell> How far away is the 2.1 release?
[10:06:48] <alex_joni> days
[10:08:33] <slundell> ok, so I the CVS version is quite close to the final 2.1?
[10:08:53] <slundell> -I
[10:22:19] <alex_joni> slundell: the one on the v2-1_branch
[10:22:34] <alex_joni> slundell: the one on the v2_1_branch
[10:23:01] <alex_joni> http://cvs.linuxcnc.org/cgi-bin/cvsweb.cgi/emc2/?only_with_tag=v2_1_branch
[10:23:39] <slundell> ok. So the when i go from v2_1_branch to the upcoming 2.1 there will not be a great deal of changes?
[10:24:11] <alex_joni> not really
[10:24:21] <alex_joni> you can also install some prerelease deb if you like
[10:24:35] <alex_joni> I mean if you don't like to waste time on compiling it yourself
[10:25:02] <alex_joni> http://wiki.linuxcnc.org/cgi-bin/emcinfo.pl?Emc2.1.0
[10:35:38] <alex_joni> bbl..
[11:17:52] <anonimasu> hello aw
[11:18:17] <Dallur> hey anonimasu
[11:18:23] <anonimasu> hello dallur
[11:19:32] <Dallur> anonimasu: man I will be glad when I am done with this object model, I woke up in the middle of the night wondering if sleep was a singleton class :P
[11:29:38] <anonimasu> :/
[11:29:40] <anonimasu> that's bad
[11:30:22] <Dallur> anonimasu: don't worry, it is :D
[11:31:56] <anonimasu> my spamfilter eats stuff today
[11:32:25] <anonimasu> ^_^
[12:51:14] <awallin> I'd like to get the wxpython GUI + vtk rendering window thing going this weekend. since I got some Z-slicing algorithm from Julian to try out...
[12:51:28] <awallin> anonimasu: have you looked at that at all?
[12:56:12] <anonimasu> awallin: jepler has something that works.
[12:56:19] <anonimasu> awallin: he owned both me and fenn..
[12:56:21] <anonimasu> :D
[12:57:50] <awallin> yeah, I saw the cutting simulation, looked nice.
[12:58:48] <anonimasu> havent worked any more on it
[12:58:49] <anonimasu> vtk is way too slow
[13:00:42] <awallin> Iäm a bit surprised if it really is too slow.
[13:01:10] <awallin> I think the calculations need to be in C/C++, but the visualization could be in python/vtk
[13:08:07] <anonimasu> it ends up being slow :/
[13:08:14] <anonimasu> as ir creates a actor per matchstick..
[13:12:53] <awallin> that needs to be done smarter then...
[13:14:22] <alex_joni> hi guys
[13:14:25] <alex_joni> how goes it?
[13:16:40] <awallin> snow and windy over here
[13:17:08] <awallin> like so http://virtual.finland.fi/netcomm/news/showarticle.asp?intNWSAID=27690
[13:25:01] <alex_joni> brrr.. looks cold
[13:40:19] <A-L-P-H-A> alex_joni, is the emc non-realtime just the simulator, or is it going the mesa route?
[13:44:43] <jepler> A-L-P-H-A: non-realtime is not capable of controlling any hardware.
[13:45:18] <A-L-P-H-A> jepler. okie. wasn't sure what the non-realtime branch was doing... I knew simulating... but wasn't sure if twas limited to just that
[13:46:07] <jepler> A-L-P-H-A: yes: for users, the point of non-realtime is to do things like preview and simulate g-code. for developers, another point of non-realtime is easier debugging and development of everything besides the hardware drivers
[13:46:18] <A-L-P-H-A> I'm under the impression that the mesa, is just a pulse generator... simular to g-rex. Will I be passing it the gcode, or emc handles the gcode, and sends the pulse generating commands to the mesa? or passing gcodes to the mesa, and mesa handles everything afterwards?
[13:46:35] <A-L-P-H-A> jepler. okie.
[13:48:02] <alex_joni> A-L-P-H-A: the mesa as it is now takes some analog dac's values, and sets those
[13:48:09] <alex_joni> it also counts encoders
[13:48:17] <alex_joni> and emc2 does the PID & corrections & all
[13:48:21] <alex_joni> that needs realtime
[13:48:48] <A-L-P-H-A> I'm jus trying to visualize what does what atm.
[13:49:07] <alex_joni> I suspect a full intepreter like thing won't fit inside the mesa
[13:50:14] <alex_joni> bbl
[13:50:19] <A-L-P-H-A> lates
[13:50:55] <awallin> the mesa has pwm generators, and encoder counters
[13:51:14] <awallin> emc reads the value of the encoder counter, and commands the pwm generator to generate pwm at a certain rate
[13:51:15] <A-L-P-H-A> I'm gonna draw this out... as I'm sure others may have the same Qs.
[13:51:54] <awallin> A-L-P-H-A: if you look at the mesa website, they do have a SoftDMC config, which includes trajectory generation etc, but that config is not used with emc
[13:57:32] <jepler> A-L-P-H-A: the HAL pins, parameters, and functions of the 5i20 card as used by emc2 are shown in the manal, http://linuxcnc.org/docs/2.1/HAL_User_Manual.pdf PDF page 58-63
[13:57:53] <A-L-P-H-A> checking
[13:58:13] <jepler> er document page 58-63
[14:11:36] <lerman> I was just looking at these pages. On page 60, it describes "(U16) m5i20.<board>.watchdog-control – Configures the watchdog." It then refers to Bit 1 and Bit 16. Do we really number bits starting at one rather than at zero? The data types shown on page 11 include U32, but not U16. Is this a bug? Or am I missing something?
[14:20:12] <anonimasu> lerman: _if_ a german wrote it it can be either way :D
[14:21:06] <lerman> And would the bit start counting at the MSB or LSB? (Or in the middle?)
[14:55:47] <jepler> lerman: historically there was a "U16" HAL type, but it was removed during the 2.1 development cycle. I guess it wasn't fixed in all the documentation.
[14:56:28] <jepler> lerman: I'm sure that "bit 1" refers to the bit with weight 0x1 and "bit 16" refers to the bit with weight 0x8000
[14:58:53] <lerman> That's what I assume. But out of context, if I just saw a reference to bit 1, I would think it was weight 0x2. The fact that there was a bit 16 clued me in. There should be something explicit. And there should be a standard defined in the document. I would suggest that bit 0 through bit 15 would be "more standard".
[15:03:31] <jepler> actually .. it's the heading "bit" which is misleading
[15:03:57] <jepler> "Typically, the useful values are 0 (watchdog disabled) or 20 (8ms watchdog enabled, cleared by dac-write)"
[15:04:12] <jepler> 20 = 4 + 16
[15:04:29] <lerman> Correct.
[15:11:05] <jepler> worse yet that's the 'motenc' card's watchdog documentation -- m5i20's documentation is different
[15:12:08] <lerman> I'm very impressed by that manual. (And by the underlying product).
[15:12:51] <jepler> A lot of work has gone into the manual, but it is far from perfect
[15:13:02] <lerman> --although I've yet to use HAL. I'm still using EMC1. (Well, it was just EMC when I started to use it.)
[15:13:48] <lerman> Reminds me of a product I used called "Final Word". ... and then they revised it to be "Final Word II" if that makes sense.
[15:14:41] <CIA-8> 03jepler 07v2_1_branch * 10emc2/docs/src/hal/drivers.lyx: fix and clarify watchdog-control documentation for m5i20 and motenc. change pin types to u32
[15:15:11] <jepler> hah
[15:15:12] <CIA-8> 03jepler 07v2_1_branch * 10emc2/docs/src/gui/halui.lyx: update documentation to match the implementation
[15:15:30] <CIA-8> 03jepler 07v2_1_branch * 10emc2/docs/src/gui/halui.lyx: update documentation to match the implementation
[15:17:28] <CIA-8> 03jepler 07v2_1_branch * 10emc2/docs/src/hal/tutorial.lyx: update documentation to match the implementation
[15:20:17] <CIA-8> 03jepler 07TRUNK * 10emc2/docs/src/hal/ (drivers.lyx tutorial.lyx): merge from v2_1_branch: update documentation to match the implementation. fix watchdog documentation for m5i20 and motenc
[15:20:52] <CIA-8> 03jepler 07TRUNK * 10emc2/docs/src/gui/halui.lyx: merge from v2_1_branch: update documentation to match the implementation
[15:29:16] <CIA-8> 03jepler 07v2_1_branch * 10emc2/docs/src/Submakefile: include all section1 manpages in html index
[15:29:27] <CIA-8> 03jepler 07v2_1_branch * 10emc2/docs/src/index.tmpl: include new lyx documentation sections
[15:30:24] <rayh> so that's where it is.
[15:33:04] <CIA-8> 03jepler 07TRUNK * 10emc2/docs/src/Submakefile: merge rev 1.28.2.6: include all section1 manpages in html index
[15:34:03] <CIA-8> 03cradek 07v2_1_branch * 10emc2/docs/src/gcode/main.lyx:
[15:34:03] <CIA-8> a few clarifications and typo fixes, plus avoidance of the word "start"
[15:34:03] <CIA-8> which has a special meaning when talking about threads
[16:03:22] <CIA-8> 03cradek 07v2_1_branch * 10emc2/docs/src/gcode/main.lyx: stupid whitespace fix
[16:10:16] <CIA-8> 03cradek 07v2_1_branch * 10emc2/docs/src/gcode/main.lyx: typo fix and clarification
[16:24:27] <awallin> ?
[16:25:06] <alex_joni> !
[16:25:32] <Dallur> .
[02:21:26] <SWPLinux> interesting
[02:23:46] <SWPadnos> alex_joni, I had to change the script to use chat.freenode.net instead of irc.freenode.net to get the loggers to start
[02:24:30] <SWPadnos> alex_joni, or at least, after multiple failed attempts to start them, they worked after I did that
[02:25:34] <CIA-8> 03cradek 07v2_1_branch * 10emc2/nc_files/g76.ngc: threading cycle for inside threads too, which changes the g76 syntax again; trying to keep it as sane and logical as possible.
[02:25:36] <CIA-8> 03cradek 07v2_1_branch * 10emc2/src/emc/rs274ngc/interp_convert.cc: threading cycle for inside threads too, which changes the g76 syntax again; trying to keep it as sane and logical as possible.
[02:36:11] <Nicolas35LA> Hi all, is there a text mode (command line or other) utility to send mdi commands?
[02:36:18] <Nicolas35LA> for EMC2
[02:41:23] <fenn> "jdi.py" does something like that
[02:41:39] <Nicolas35LA> thank you
[02:41:47] <Nicolas35LA> mdi I suppose?
[02:41:57] <Nicolas35LA> mdi.py
[02:42:26] <fenn> http://axis.unpy.net/01167419757
[02:43:31] <fenn> it might cause problems because it goes into estop at the end of every line
[02:43:43] <Nicolas35LA> ok
[02:43:46] <fenn> so, just remove the c.state(emc.STATE_ESTOP)
[02:43:49] <Nicolas35LA> I will look at the code
[02:43:57] <Nicolas35LA> thank you
[02:45:12] <fenn> ah here we go
[02:45:13] <fenn> AXIS includes a program called ``mdi'' which allows text-mode entry of MDI commands to a running emc session. You can run this program by opening a terminal and typing
[02:45:13] <fenn> mdi /path/to/emc.nml
[02:45:26] <cradek> jdi runs an entire file, mdi runs one command
[02:47:53] <Nicolas35LA> great
[02:48:28] <cradek> they're both useful as-is but were primarily written to show the simple python interface to EMC
[02:48:42] <Nicolas35LA> exactly what I was looking for actually
[02:48:51] <cradek> great
[02:56:00] <fenn> is emc.stat() where axis gets the data for the backplot?
[02:56:13] <cradek> yes
[02:56:24] <cradek> and many other things
[03:59:37] <CIA-8> 03jepler 07v2_1_branch * 10emc2/docs/src/gcode/main.lyx: start on g76 documentaton
[03:59:51] <jepler> good night everyone
[04:00:20] <skunkworks> Night jepler
[04:12:01] <SWPadnos_> SWPadnos_ is now known as SWPadnos
[05:28:35] <Jymmmm> SWPadnos: The 400 disc DVD player isn't IDE =(
[05:38:56] <CIA-8> 03jmkasunich 07v2_1_branch * 10emc2/docs/src/gcode/main.lyx: minor tweaks to G76 docs
[05:39:10] <jmkasunich> goodnight all
[07:08:59] <ds3> hmmm
[07:27:43] <K`zan> Night all
[08:05:51] <alex_joni> SWPadnos: yeah, but that means they log to a different folder now, and that's no good
[09:57:56] <slundell> How far away is the 2.1 release?
[10:06:48] <alex_joni> days
[10:08:33] <slundell> ok, so I the CVS version is quite close to the final 2.1?
[10:08:53] <slundell> -I
[10:22:19] <alex_joni> slundell: the one on the v2-1_branch
[10:22:34] <alex_joni> slundell: the one on the v2_1_branch
[10:23:01] <alex_joni> http://cvs.linuxcnc.org/cgi-bin/cvsweb.cgi/emc2/?only_with_tag=v2_1_branch
[10:23:39] <slundell> ok. So the when i go from v2_1_branch to the upcoming 2.1 there will not be a great deal of changes?
[10:24:11] <alex_joni> not really
[10:24:21] <alex_joni> you can also install some prerelease deb if you like
[10:24:35] <alex_joni> I mean if you don't like to waste time on compiling it yourself
[10:25:02] <alex_joni> http://wiki.linuxcnc.org/cgi-bin/emcinfo.pl?Emc2.1.0
[10:35:38] <alex_joni> bbl..
[11:17:52] <anonimasu> hello aw
[11:18:17] <Dallur> hey anonimasu
[11:18:23] <anonimasu> hello dallur
[11:19:32] <Dallur> anonimasu: man I will be glad when I am done with this object model, I woke up in the middle of the night wondering if sleep was a singleton class :P
[11:29:38] <anonimasu> :/
[11:29:40] <anonimasu> that's bad
[11:30:22] <Dallur> anonimasu: don't worry, it is :D
[11:31:56] <anonimasu> my spamfilter eats stuff today
[11:32:25] <anonimasu> ^_^
[12:51:14] <awallin> I'd like to get the wxpython GUI + vtk rendering window thing going this weekend. since I got some Z-slicing algorithm from Julian to try out...
[12:51:28] <awallin> anonimasu: have you looked at that at all?
[12:56:12] <anonimasu> awallin: jepler has something that works.
[12:56:19] <anonimasu> awallin: he owned both me and fenn..
[12:56:21] <anonimasu> :D
[12:57:50] <awallin> yeah, I saw the cutting simulation, looked nice.
[12:58:48] <anonimasu> havent worked any more on it
[12:58:49] <anonimasu> vtk is way too slow
[13:00:42] <awallin> Iäm a bit surprised if it really is too slow.
[13:01:10] <awallin> I think the calculations need to be in C/C++, but the visualization could be in python/vtk
[13:08:07] <anonimasu> it ends up being slow :/
[13:08:14] <anonimasu> as ir creates a actor per matchstick..
[13:12:53] <awallin> that needs to be done smarter then...
[13:14:22] <alex_joni> hi guys
[13:14:25] <alex_joni> how goes it?
[13:16:40] <awallin> snow and windy over here
[13:17:08] <awallin> like so http://virtual.finland.fi/netcomm/news/showarticle.asp?intNWSAID=27690
[13:25:01] <alex_joni> brrr.. looks cold
[13:40:19] <A-L-P-H-A> alex_joni, is the emc non-realtime just the simulator, or is it going the mesa route?
[13:44:43] <jepler> A-L-P-H-A: non-realtime is not capable of controlling any hardware.
[13:45:18] <A-L-P-H-A> jepler. okie. wasn't sure what the non-realtime branch was doing... I knew simulating... but wasn't sure if twas limited to just that
[13:46:07] <jepler> A-L-P-H-A: yes: for users, the point of non-realtime is to do things like preview and simulate g-code. for developers, another point of non-realtime is easier debugging and development of everything besides the hardware drivers
[13:46:18] <A-L-P-H-A> I'm under the impression that the mesa, is just a pulse generator... simular to g-rex. Will I be passing it the gcode, or emc handles the gcode, and sends the pulse generating commands to the mesa? or passing gcodes to the mesa, and mesa handles everything afterwards?
[13:46:35] <A-L-P-H-A> jepler. okie.
[13:48:02] <alex_joni> A-L-P-H-A: the mesa as it is now takes some analog dac's values, and sets those
[13:48:09] <alex_joni> it also counts encoders
[13:48:17] <alex_joni> and emc2 does the PID & corrections & all
[13:48:21] <alex_joni> that needs realtime
[13:48:48] <A-L-P-H-A> I'm jus trying to visualize what does what atm.
[13:49:07] <alex_joni> I suspect a full intepreter like thing won't fit inside the mesa
[13:50:14] <alex_joni> bbl
[13:50:19] <A-L-P-H-A> lates
[13:50:55] <awallin> the mesa has pwm generators, and encoder counters
[13:51:14] <awallin> emc reads the value of the encoder counter, and commands the pwm generator to generate pwm at a certain rate
[13:51:15] <A-L-P-H-A> I'm gonna draw this out... as I'm sure others may have the same Qs.
[13:51:54] <awallin> A-L-P-H-A: if you look at the mesa website, they do have a SoftDMC config, which includes trajectory generation etc, but that config is not used with emc
[13:57:32] <jepler> A-L-P-H-A: the HAL pins, parameters, and functions of the 5i20 card as used by emc2 are shown in the manal, http://linuxcnc.org/docs/2.1/HAL_User_Manual.pdf PDF page 58-63
[13:57:53] <A-L-P-H-A> checking
[13:58:13] <jepler> er document page 58-63
[14:11:36] <lerman> I was just looking at these pages. On page 60, it describes "(U16) m5i20.<board>.watchdog-control – Configures the watchdog." It then refers to Bit 1 and Bit 16. Do we really number bits starting at one rather than at zero? The data types shown on page 11 include U32, but not U16. Is this a bug? Or am I missing something?
[14:20:12] <anonimasu> lerman: _if_ a german wrote it it can be either way :D
[14:21:06] <lerman> And would the bit start counting at the MSB or LSB? (Or in the middle?)
[14:55:47] <jepler> lerman: historically there was a "U16" HAL type, but it was removed during the 2.1 development cycle. I guess it wasn't fixed in all the documentation.
[14:56:28] <jepler> lerman: I'm sure that "bit 1" refers to the bit with weight 0x1 and "bit 16" refers to the bit with weight 0x8000
[14:58:53] <lerman> That's what I assume. But out of context, if I just saw a reference to bit 1, I would think it was weight 0x2. The fact that there was a bit 16 clued me in. There should be something explicit. And there should be a standard defined in the document. I would suggest that bit 0 through bit 15 would be "more standard".
[15:03:31] <jepler> actually .. it's the heading "bit" which is misleading
[15:03:57] <jepler> "Typically, the useful values are 0 (watchdog disabled) or 20 (8ms watchdog enabled, cleared by dac-write)"
[15:04:12] <jepler> 20 = 4 + 16
[15:04:29] <lerman> Correct.
[15:11:05] <jepler> worse yet that's the 'motenc' card's watchdog documentation -- m5i20's documentation is different
[15:12:08] <lerman> I'm very impressed by that manual. (And by the underlying product).
[15:12:51] <jepler> A lot of work has gone into the manual, but it is far from perfect
[15:13:02] <lerman> --although I've yet to use HAL. I'm still using EMC1. (Well, it was just EMC when I started to use it.)
[15:13:48] <lerman> Reminds me of a product I used called "Final Word". ... and then they revised it to be "Final Word II" if that makes sense.
[15:14:41] <CIA-8> 03jepler 07v2_1_branch * 10emc2/docs/src/hal/drivers.lyx: fix and clarify watchdog-control documentation for m5i20 and motenc. change pin types to u32
[15:15:11] <jepler> hah
[15:15:12] <CIA-8> 03jepler 07v2_1_branch * 10emc2/docs/src/gui/halui.lyx: update documentation to match the implementation
[15:15:30] <CIA-8> 03jepler 07v2_1_branch * 10emc2/docs/src/gui/halui.lyx: update documentation to match the implementation
[15:17:28] <CIA-8> 03jepler 07v2_1_branch * 10emc2/docs/src/hal/tutorial.lyx: update documentation to match the implementation
[15:20:17] <CIA-8> 03jepler 07TRUNK * 10emc2/docs/src/hal/ (drivers.lyx tutorial.lyx): merge from v2_1_branch: update documentation to match the implementation. fix watchdog documentation for m5i20 and motenc
[15:20:52] <CIA-8> 03jepler 07TRUNK * 10emc2/docs/src/gui/halui.lyx: merge from v2_1_branch: update documentation to match the implementation
[15:29:16] <CIA-8> 03jepler 07v2_1_branch * 10emc2/docs/src/Submakefile: include all section1 manpages in html index
[15:29:27] <CIA-8> 03jepler 07v2_1_branch * 10emc2/docs/src/index.tmpl: include new lyx documentation sections
[15:30:24] <rayh> so that's where it is.
[15:33:04] <CIA-8> 03jepler 07TRUNK * 10emc2/docs/src/Submakefile: merge rev 1.28.2.6: include all section1 manpages in html index
[15:34:03] <CIA-8> 03cradek 07v2_1_branch * 10emc2/docs/src/gcode/main.lyx:
[15:34:03] <CIA-8> a few clarifications and typo fixes, plus avoidance of the word "start"
[15:34:03] <CIA-8> which has a special meaning when talking about threads
[16:03:22] <CIA-8> 03cradek 07v2_1_branch * 10emc2/docs/src/gcode/main.lyx: stupid whitespace fix
[16:10:16] <CIA-8> 03cradek 07v2_1_branch * 10emc2/docs/src/gcode/main.lyx: typo fix and clarification
[16:24:27] <awallin> ?
[16:25:06] <alex_joni> !
[16:25:32] <Dallur> .
[17:16:59] <anonimasu> hey
[17:17:37] <anonimasu> my Z works great now
[17:18:01] <awallin> tuned it right now?
[17:18:13] <anonimasu> no
[17:18:24] <anonimasu> just set pid_max_vel down
[17:18:32] <anonimasu> im playing with accels now
[17:18:38] <alex_joni> nice
[17:19:05] <anonimasu> 60 as acceleration now :)
[17:19:16] <anonimasu> maybe I can do 3d contouring with it... without gearing
[17:19:33] <anonimasu> hm
[17:19:40] <anonimasu> it fucks up when I jog x/y togther with it
[17:21:21] <anonimasu> wtf.
[17:21:44] <anonimasu> :(
[17:21:47] <A-L-P-H-A> anonimasu, :(
[17:21:49] <A-L-P-H-A> shibs.
[17:21:56] <anonimasu> this drives me mad..
[17:22:05] <anonimasu> I'll hook up the scope now
[17:22:07] <A-L-P-H-A> as opposed the mad driving you?
[17:22:41] <anonimasu> yeah
[17:35:30] <anonimasu> I found the major error..
[17:35:39] <anonimasu> my recfifier is too puny
[17:36:16] <alex_joni> :D
[17:38:04] <anonimasu> I wonder if geckos live with 83V
[17:38:15] <ejholmgren> wheeeeeeeeeeeeeeee
[17:38:27] <anonimasu> or if they will fry.
[17:38:32] <ejholmgren> it's been a long time since I compiled a kernel on a machine that was worth a sh*t
[17:38:38] <rayh> I believe that they are tested to near 100 volt.
[17:39:13] <anonimasu> rayh: thanks
[17:39:29] <anonimasu> I put a batt charger in series...
[17:39:30] <anonimasu> ;)
[17:39:35] <anonimasu> need to find my other rectifier..
[17:41:37] <alex_joni> anonimasu: they are rated 80V
[17:41:55] <alex_joni> they work up to 90V but I wouldn't go there unless really desperate :)
[17:42:03] <anonimasu> oh 83 will be fine then..
[17:42:11] <anonimasu> I cant find the other rectifier..
[17:43:07] <anonimasu> neat
[17:43:13] <anonimasu> it's all looking good
[17:43:52] <anonimasu> got my accel up to 100 on the Z
[17:46:20] <alex_joni> get your boats :D
[17:46:43] <anonimasu> haha
[17:46:44] <anonimasu> boats?
[17:46:51] <alex_joni> * alex_joni floods again
[17:46:59] <anonimasu> :D
[17:47:01] <anonimasu> ok
[17:47:06] <anonimasu> * anonimasu jumps in
[17:50:45] <CIA-8> 03alex_joni 07v2_1_branch * 10emc2/configs/dallur-thc/dallur-advanced.ini: get rid of double values for INPUT/OUTPUT_SCALE as they are not needed/used. HAL only takes one value, and emc doesn't read the seconds param
[17:50:43] <CIA-8> 03alex_joni 07v2_1_branch * 10emc2/configs/demo_mazak/demo_mazak.ini: get rid of double values for INPUT/OUTPUT_SCALE as they are not needed/used. HAL only takes one value, and emc doesn't read the seconds param
[17:50:44] <CIA-8> 03alex_joni 07v2_1_branch * 10emc2/configs/demo_sim_cl/demo_sim_cl.ini: get rid of double values for INPUT/OUTPUT_SCALE as they are not needed/used. HAL only takes one value, and emc doesn't read the seconds param
[17:50:45] <CIA-8> 03alex_joni 07v2_1_branch * 10emc2/configs/demo_step_cl/demo_step_cl.ini: get rid of double values for INPUT/OUTPUT_SCALE as they are not needed/used. HAL only takes one value, and emc doesn't read the seconds param
[17:50:50] <CIA-8> 03alex_joni 07v2_1_branch * 10emc2/configs/etch-servo/etch.ini: get rid of double values for INPUT/OUTPUT_SCALE as they are not needed/used. HAL only takes one value, and emc doesn't read the seconds param
[17:51:00] <CIA-8> 03alex_joni 07v2_1_branch * 10emc2/configs/halui_halvcp/halui.ini: get rid of double values for INPUT/OUTPUT_SCALE as they are not needed/used. HAL only takes one value, and emc doesn't read the seconds param
[17:51:02] <CIA-8> 03alex_joni 07v2_1_branch * 10emc2/configs/hexapod-sim/minitetra.ini: get rid of double values for INPUT/OUTPUT_SCALE as they are not needed/used. HAL only takes one value, and emc doesn't read the seconds param
[17:51:02] <CIA-8> 03alex_joni 07v2_1_branch * 10emc2/configs/lathe-pluto/lathe-pluto.ini: get rid of double values for INPUT/OUTPUT_SCALE as they are not needed/used. HAL only takes one value, and emc doesn't read the seconds param
[17:51:04] <CIA-8> 03alex_joni 07v2_1_branch * 10emc2/configs/m5i20/m5i20.ini: get rid of double values for INPUT/OUTPUT_SCALE as they are not needed/used. HAL only takes one value, and emc doesn't read the seconds param
[17:51:05] <CIA-8> 03alex_joni 07v2_1_branch * 10emc2/configs/max/max.ini: get rid of double values for INPUT/OUTPUT_SCALE as they are not needed/used. HAL only takes one value, and emc doesn't read the seconds param
[17:51:08] <CIA-8> 03alex_joni 07v2_1_branch * 10emc2/configs/motenc/motenc.ini: get rid of double values for INPUT/OUTPUT_SCALE as they are not needed/used. HAL only takes one value, and emc doesn't read the seconds param
[17:51:11] <CIA-8> 03alex_joni 07v2_1_branch * 10emc2/configs/nist-lathe/inch.ini: get rid of double values for INPUT/OUTPUT_SCALE as they are not needed/used. HAL only takes one value, and emc doesn't read the seconds param
[17:51:14] <CIA-8> 03alex_joni 07v2_1_branch * 10emc2/configs/ppmc/ppmc.ini: get rid of double values for INPUT/OUTPUT_SCALE as they are not needed/used. HAL only takes one value, and emc doesn't read the seconds param
[17:51:19] <CIA-8> 03alex_joni 07v2_1_branch * 10emc2/configs/stepper/ (sim_inch.ini stepper_inch.ini stepper_mm.ini): get rid of double values for INPUT/OUTPUT_SCALE as they are not needed/used. HAL only takes one value, and emc doesn't read the seconds param
[17:51:23] <CIA-8> 03alex_joni 07v2_1_branch * 10emc2/configs/stepper-xyza/inch.ini: get rid of double values for INPUT/OUTPUT_SCALE as they are not needed/used. HAL only takes one value, and emc doesn't read the seconds param
[17:51:28] <CIA-8> 03alex_joni 07v2_1_branch * 10emc2/configs/sim/ (8 files): get rid of double values for INPUT/OUTPUT_SCALE as they are not needed/used. HAL only takes one value, and emc doesn't read the seconds param
[17:51:33] <CIA-8> 03alex_joni 07v2_1_branch * 10emc2/configs/stg/stg.ini: get rid of double values for INPUT/OUTPUT_SCALE as they are not needed/used. HAL only takes one value, and emc doesn't read the seconds param
[17:51:36] <CIA-8> 03alex_joni 07v2_1_branch * 10emc2/configs/univpwm/univpwm.ini: get rid of double values for INPUT/OUTPUT_SCALE as they are not needed/used. HAL only takes one value, and emc doesn't read the seconds param
[17:51:41] <CIA-8> 03alex_joni 07v2_1_branch * 10emc2/configs/univstep/univstep.ini: get rid of double values for INPUT/OUTPUT_SCALE as they are not needed/used. HAL only takes one value, and emc doesn't read the seconds param
[17:51:44] <CIA-8> 03alex_joni 07v2_1_branch * 10emc2/configs/vti/vti.ini: get rid of double values for INPUT/OUTPUT_SCALE as they are not needed/used. HAL only takes one value, and emc doesn't read the seconds param
[18:01:07] <alex_joni> anonimasu: don't get out of that boat
[18:02:46] <CIA-8> 03alex_joni 07TRUNK * 10emc2/configs/dallur-thc/dallur-advanced.ini: get rid of double values for INPUT/OUTPUT_SCALE as they are not needed/used. HAL only takes one value, and emc doesn't read the seconds param
[18:02:46] <CIA-8> 03alex_joni 07TRUNK * 10emc2/configs/demo_mazak/demo_mazak.ini: get rid of double values for INPUT/OUTPUT_SCALE as they are not needed/used. HAL only takes one value, and emc doesn't read the seconds param
[18:02:47] <CIA-8> 03alex_joni 07TRUNK * 10emc2/configs/demo_sim_cl/demo_sim_cl.ini: get rid of double values for INPUT/OUTPUT_SCALE as they are not needed/used. HAL only takes one value, and emc doesn't read the seconds param
[18:02:48] <CIA-8> 03alex_joni 07TRUNK * 10emc2/configs/demo_step_cl/demo_step_cl.ini: get rid of double values for INPUT/OUTPUT_SCALE as they are not needed/used. HAL only takes one value, and emc doesn't read the seconds param
[18:02:51] <CIA-8> 03alex_joni 07TRUNK * 10emc2/configs/etch-servo/etch.ini: get rid of double values for INPUT/OUTPUT_SCALE as they are not needed/used. HAL only takes one value, and emc doesn't read the seconds param
[18:02:54] <CIA-8> 03alex_joni 07TRUNK * 10emc2/configs/hexapod-sim/minitetra.ini: get rid of double values for INPUT/OUTPUT_SCALE as they are not needed/used. HAL only takes one value, and emc doesn't read the seconds param
[18:02:57] <CIA-8> 03alex_joni 07TRUNK * 10emc2/configs/halui_halvcp/halui.ini: get rid of double values for INPUT/OUTPUT_SCALE as they are not needed/used. HAL only takes one value, and emc doesn't read the seconds param
[18:03:00] <CIA-8> 03alex_joni 07TRUNK * 10emc2/configs/lathe-pluto/lathe-pluto.ini: get rid of double values for INPUT/OUTPUT_SCALE as they are not needed/used. HAL only takes one value, and emc doesn't read the seconds param
[18:03:09] <CIA-8> 03alex_joni 07TRUNK * 10emc2/configs/m5i20/m5i20.ini: get rid of double values for INPUT/OUTPUT_SCALE as they are not needed/used. HAL only takes one value, and emc doesn't read the seconds param
[18:03:10] <CIA-8> 03alex_joni 07TRUNK * 10emc2/configs/max/max.ini: get rid of double values for INPUT/OUTPUT_SCALE as they are not needed/used. HAL only takes one value, and emc doesn't read the seconds param
[18:03:13] <CIA-8> 03alex_joni 07TRUNK * 10emc2/configs/motenc/motenc.ini: get rid of double values for INPUT/OUTPUT_SCALE as they are not needed/used. HAL only takes one value, and emc doesn't read the seconds param
[18:03:20] <CIA-8> 03alex_joni 07TRUNK * 10emc2/configs/nist-lathe/inch.ini: get rid of double values for INPUT/OUTPUT_SCALE as they are not needed/used. HAL only takes one value, and emc doesn't read the seconds param
[18:03:23] <CIA-8> 03alex_joni 07TRUNK * 10emc2/configs/ppmc/ppmc.ini: get rid of double values for INPUT/OUTPUT_SCALE as they are not needed/used. HAL only takes one value, and emc doesn't read the seconds param
[18:03:24] <CIA-8> 03alex_joni 07TRUNK * 10emc2/configs/stepper-xyza/inch.ini: get rid of double values for INPUT/OUTPUT_SCALE as they are not needed/used. HAL only takes one value, and emc doesn't read the seconds param
[18:03:31] <CIA-8> 03alex_joni 07TRUNK * 10emc2/configs/sim/ (8 files): get rid of double values for INPUT/OUTPUT_SCALE as they are not needed/used. HAL only takes one value, and emc doesn't read the seconds param
[18:03:34] <CIA-8> 03alex_joni 07TRUNK * 10emc2/configs/stepper/ (sim_inch.ini stepper_inch.ini stepper_mm.ini): get rid of double values for INPUT/OUTPUT_SCALE as they are not needed/used. HAL only takes one value, and emc doesn't read the seconds param
[18:03:36] <CIA-8> 03alex_joni 07TRUNK * 10emc2/configs/stg/stg.ini: get rid of double values for INPUT/OUTPUT_SCALE as they are not needed/used. HAL only takes one value, and emc doesn't read the seconds param
[18:03:43] <CIA-8> 03alex_joni 07TRUNK * 10emc2/configs/univstep/univstep.ini: get rid of double values for INPUT/OUTPUT_SCALE as they are not needed/used. HAL only takes one value, and emc doesn't read the seconds param
[18:03:49] <CIA-8> 03alex_joni 07TRUNK * 10emc2/configs/vti/vti.ini: get rid of double values for INPUT/OUTPUT_SCALE as they are not needed/used. HAL only takes one value, and emc doesn't read the seconds param
[18:03:49] <CIA-8> 03alex_joni 07TRUNK * 10emc2/configs/univpwm/univpwm.ini: get rid of double values for INPUT/OUTPUT_SCALE as they are not needed/used. HAL only takes one value, and emc doesn't read the seconds param
[18:05:08] <lerneaen_hydra> 'lo all
[18:05:08] <CIA-8> 03alex_joni 07TRUNK * 10emc2/TODO: update todo's
[18:10:15] <CIA-8> 03alex_joni 07v2_1_branch * 10emc2/debian/changelog: bump to version alpha2
[18:11:50] <alex_joni> hi LH
[18:13:14] <ejholmgren> * ejholmgren drowns
[18:13:26] <alex_joni> ejholmgren: I stopped
[18:13:42] <lerneaen_hydra> whays happening?
[18:14:02] <alex_joni> getting ready for the big day :)
[18:14:07] <lerneaen_hydra> big day?
[18:14:10] <ejholmgren> I can dcc anyone the flu if they want it :)
[18:14:14] <alex_joni> emc2.1.0
[18:14:17] <lerneaen_hydra> ooh
[18:14:29] <lerneaen_hydra> end of jan?
[18:14:45] <alex_joni> I think after this weekend
[18:15:08] <ejholmgren> is there any chance the splash screen will ever get an update?
[18:15:20] <ejholmgren> I want to kill that penguin every time I start emc
[18:15:35] <SWPadnos> change it in your ini file
[18:15:44] <lerneaen_hydra> ooh, nice :D
[18:16:09] <alex_joni> ejholmgren: what update?
[18:16:20] <lerneaen_hydra> ejholmgren; what's bad with the splash-screen?
[18:16:25] <SWPLinux> [DISPLAY]INTRO_GRAPHIC and INTRO_TIME
[18:16:53] <lerneaen_hydra> the clouds may not be too fitting, and gif isn't exactly the best format for something like that, but otherwise it's quite good IMO
[18:17:01] <ejholmgren> <-- coffee and nyquil
[18:17:06] <ejholmgren> don't listen to me
[18:17:08] <alex_joni> lerneaen_hydra: thank you :P
[18:17:24] <lerneaen_hydra> ejholmgren; hahaha
[18:18:29] <alex_joni> how do you spell erroneous ?
[18:18:34] <SWPLinux> erroneously
[18:18:37] <SWPLinux> :)
[18:19:02] <lerneaen_hydra> haha
[18:19:05] <SWPLinux> man. 0 degrees (F) with a wind feels quite chilly
[18:19:15] <skunkworks> 'wind chill'
[18:19:17] <A-L-P-H-A> what's that in real units?
[18:19:26] <alex_joni> -32
[18:19:38] <A-L-P-H-A> in °C??
[18:19:39] <SWPLinux> -18C plus wind wind
[18:19:46] <SWPLinux> windy wind
[18:19:49] <lerman> Instead of Tux, show a picture of one of the developers, a different one chosen at random, each time it starts. That way, it may be ugly, but it will not be the same old Penguin.
[18:19:51] <alex_joni> err.. -18
[18:19:57] <lerman> :-)
[18:20:04] <SWPLinux> lerman: we'd rather annoy people than scare them
[18:20:04] <lerneaen_hydra> lerman; hahaha
[18:20:07] <A-L-P-H-A> it was -20 with windchill last weekend.
[18:20:13] <lerneaen_hydra> you might scare them off ;)
[18:20:31] <A-L-P-H-A> lerneaen_hydra... install ut99, running, up?
[18:20:34] <CIA-8> 03alex_joni 07v2_1_branch * 10emc2/docs/src/quickstart/stepper_quickstart.lyx: remove erroneous(ly = as SWP said) info
[18:20:37] <lerman> Only the stout of heart may proceed beyond this point.
[18:20:38] <skunkworks> You can use encoders with steppers - setting a following error - can't you?
[18:20:49] <alex_joni> skunkworks: yes
[18:20:54] <skunkworks> thanks.
[18:20:54] <lerneaen_hydra> A-L-P-H-A; I'm actually having a funny issue with it, you might be able to help
[18:21:02] <ejholmgren> hrmmnn.... goat.se with an appropriately place stepper or servo?
[18:21:02] <SWPLinux> A-L-P-H-A: the wind chill is -16.7F here, which is around -27C
[18:21:03] <A-L-P-H-A> lerneaen_hydra, which is?
[18:21:18] <lerneaen_hydra> when I exit all my keyboard hotkeys die (volume, next/prev track etc)
[18:21:19] <A-L-P-H-A> SWPadnos, oh. that's COLD.
[18:21:31] <SWPLinux> I know - I just came back inside ;)
[18:21:51] <SWPLinux> I decided not to clear the driveway today
[18:21:54] <CIA-8> 03alex_joni 07TRUNK * 10emc2/docs/src/quickstart/stepper_quickstart.lyx: remove erroneous(ly = as SWP said) info
[18:22:09] <SWPLinux> heh
[18:22:11] <skunkworks> http://www.cnczone.com/forums/showthread.php?p=248513#post248513
[18:22:20] <SWPLinux> you have to give me context there ;)
[18:22:36] <A-L-P-H-A> lerneaen_hydra... but only after you exit. :) so ... all good. :D
[18:22:35] <alex_joni> that would make the commit message too long :)
[18:22:53] <lerneaen_hydra> A-L-P-H-A; haha, it fucks up with my media player :p
[18:22:58] <alex_joni> skunkworks: great
[18:23:01] <lerneaen_hydra> and I have to restart X to fix it :/
[18:23:25] <lerneaen_hydra> A-L-P-H-A; heard of stuff like that before?
[18:23:47] <alex_joni> although it's possible to sum all ferrors, and substract that from 1, scale and send to adaptive-feed
[18:24:01] <alex_joni> that way they will go slower as ferror is greater
[18:24:02] <A-L-P-H-A> lerneaen_hydra.... awhhhhhh... well... in that case... you're perfectly able to play
[18:24:31] <lerneaen_hydra> A-L-P-H-A; sure ;) just let me check through the release notes and see if its there
[18:24:32] <skunkworks> alex_joni: Ok.. This guy seems to have no clue. Trying to start easy.
[18:24:43] <alex_joni> skunkworks: I wouldn't try what I just said
[18:24:55] <skunkworks> :)
[18:26:20] <SWPLinux> you'd want a vector sum, not a straight sum
[18:26:33] <lerneaen_hydra> A-L-P-H-A; bah, screw that, I
[18:26:39] <lerneaen_hydra> 'll restart X when I'm done
[18:26:42] <A-L-P-H-A> lerneaen_hydra, just play. :D
[18:26:46] <SWPLinux> actually, you'd want a max ratio, and then to limit by the axis that's the farthest "behind"
[18:27:09] <lerneaen_hydra> A-L-P-H-A; server? ip?
[18:27:43] <A-L-P-H-A> 208.100.20.10:7777
[18:28:04] <lerneaen_hydra> your own?
[18:39:56] <A-L-P-H-A> :)
[18:39:58] <lerneaen_hydra> yay
[18:39:59] <A-L-P-H-A> okay... I'm done.
[18:40:04] <A-L-P-H-A> my eyes hurt now.
[18:40:14] <lerneaen_hydra> didn't go that badly for my first real game of ut99
[18:40:22] <A-L-P-H-A> nope.
[18:40:27] <A-L-P-H-A> that was on another mod...
[18:40:38] <lerneaen_hydra> yeah
[18:40:37] <A-L-P-H-A> where it's boom sniper... just like sniper rifle + rocket launcher.
[18:40:51] <A-L-P-H-A> and some relics... which Id on't really know how to sue.
[18:40:52] <A-L-P-H-A> use
[18:41:01] <A-L-P-H-A> and some cheese grappling hook thing...
[18:41:20] <lerneaen_hydra> cheese grappling hook?
[18:41:45] <A-L-P-H-A> yeah... it shoots out this beam thing, and moves you to whereever, and holds you there, where you can stay and shoot from.
[18:42:51] <lerneaen_hydra> aha
[18:42:52] <lerneaen_hydra> I see
[18:43:07] <A-L-P-H-A> what a silly post... so useless. http://www.cnczone.com/forums/showpost.php?s=13518b3666190c8b44dbd6f3b35e94ad&p=248298&postcount=1
[18:43:50] <lerneaen_hydra> oh my
[18:44:32] <A-L-P-H-A> "Please explain as much as you can or point me in the right direction." what is the point of that sentence??
[18:46:10] <Guest920> Guest920 is now known as skunkworks
[18:54:09] <ejholmgren> A-L-P-H-A: I have this "thing" that I need "fixed"
[18:54:29] <A-L-P-H-A> ejholmgren, you man alex_joni? or me?
[18:55:06] <ejholmgren> my question is vague
[18:55:31] <lerneaen_hydra> ejholmgren; there, I fixed it
[18:55:36] <ejholmgren> thanks :)
[18:55:40] <lerneaen_hydra> np
[18:56:05] <ejholmgren> I really need to get off irc ... the nyquil is starting to really fsck me up O_o
[18:56:19] <A-L-P-H-A> ejholmgren... ohoh! nyquil... cherry.
[18:56:24] <lerneaen_hydra> noyhing like being drugged and on IRC
[18:56:51] <ejholmgren> the coffee + nyquil combo at noon is quite interesting
[18:57:01] <A-L-P-H-A> I can't take a whole dose... otherwise I'm knocked out for a good 16 hours.
[18:57:12] <A-L-P-H-A> ejholmgren, there is dayquil. :)
[19:00:22] <ejholmgren> there's also non-alcoholic beer
[19:01:06] <A-L-P-H-A> ejholmgren, you want to be knocked out? or feelig better?
[19:01:22] <A-L-P-H-A> non-alcoholic beer... WTH is that?? who drinks that pisswater.
[19:01:52] <ejholmgren> whatever I have makes me feel like I was hit by a train last night ... I'd prefer to be knocked out in this case
[19:03:46] <ejholmgren> just need to get ataraid working in one box so I can swap things around and put the PIII 1ghz on my emc box
[19:04:00] <ejholmgren> then it's passed out on the couch time
[19:05:13] <A-L-P-H-A> raid ain't too be in linux... sata raid that is.
[19:05:14] <A-L-P-H-A> md0. :)
[19:06:12] <ejholmgren> I have an old promise fasttrak 100 tx2 that I'm trying to mirror a pair of 250G drives with
[19:08:56] <ejholmgren> already had to make a dos boot disk and flash the card bios to make it do 48bit LBA
[19:09:03] <ejholmgren> I blame the russians
[19:09:15] <A-L-P-H-A> I blame americants. :D
[19:09:23] <A-L-P-H-A> russians just copy the americants anyways.
[19:09:27] <alex_joni> ejholmgren: why the russians? they are nice guys
[19:09:38] <A-L-P-H-A> alex_joni, especially their mafia. :)
[19:09:57] <alex_joni> A-L-P-H-A: it's a nicer mob than the chinese one
[19:10:08] <A-L-P-H-A> alex_joni... hmm... dunno.
[19:10:39] <tomp_> oh dimitri must have left, the russian guy whose writing myNC
[19:11:07] <A-L-P-H-A> alex_joni... hmm.
[19:11:41] <A-L-P-H-A> I just found a bad site... violations of GPL...
[19:13:02] <A-L-P-H-A> no GPL statements.
[19:20:23] <lerneaen_hydra> hmm, tuxcnc, is that paulc's page?
[19:20:44] <lerneaen_hydra> oh, nm, yeah it is
[19:20:54] <lerneaen_hydra> is this mync forked off of emc?
[19:20:59] <alex_joni> nope, not related
[19:21:11] <SWPadnos> no, it's independent because of all the FUD on tuxcnc
[19:22:09] <lerneaen_hydra> :/
[19:22:56] <alex_joni> http://www.ebay.ph/viItem?ItemId=290075169750
[19:23:01] <alex_joni> that works anti FUD
[19:25:14] <lerneaen_hydra> wtf is up with people buying stuff that generates toxic gasses and calling it healthy?
[19:25:31] <SWPLinux> if there's one thing I want, it's an ionized desk!
[19:29:34] <ejholmgren> not for sale outside of the Philippines ...
[19:35:28] <anonimasu> ^_^
[19:35:55] <lerneaen_hydra> anonimasu!
[19:36:11] <anonimasu> lh!
[19:36:16] <anonimasu> I'll be back in 20 minutes or so
[19:36:24] <anonimasu> going to pick up a parcel
[19:36:31] <lerneaen_hydra> ooh
[19:36:35] <lerneaen_hydra> nice
[19:36:51] <anonimasu> I found the error with my machine
[19:36:53] <anonimasu> ^_^
[19:37:05] <lerneaen_hydra> oh, what was it?
[19:37:13] <alex_joni> too little muscle power
[19:37:18] <anonimasu> yeah..
[19:37:20] <anonimasu> need another rectifier
[19:37:30] <anonimasu> it sags under the load
[19:37:49] <lerneaen_hydra> oh, the mill?
[19:37:51] <anonimasu> yeah
[19:37:52] <SWPLinux> a 200A supply ius sagging with 3xgeckos???
[19:37:59] <anonimasu> the rectifier does..
[19:38:08] <anonimasu> it's 200A ac.. :)
[19:38:10] <anonimasu> or 300
[19:38:09] <anonimasu> brb
[19:38:14] <lerneaen_hydra> btw, how much were the geckos? 100-150 USD?
[19:38:18] <SWPLinux> how much capacitance on the output?
[19:38:41] <SWPLinux> they're $114 for the older revisions, $140-ish for the newer ones
[19:38:50] <lerneaen_hydra> oh, I see
[19:38:54] <lerneaen_hydra> in the US or shipped?
[19:39:04] <SWPLinux> FOB US (plus shipping)
[19:39:27] <rayh> IMO don't get a 202 for a larger motor.
[19:40:01] <SWPLinux> ah - have you had a chance to play with the more recent stepper drives?
[19:40:06] <lerneaen_hydra> FOB?
[19:40:17] <SWPLinux> Freight On Board
[19:40:26] <lerneaen_hydra> ah, ok
[19:41:33] <rayh> A customer of mine had to switch his bpt machine from g202 to g201 cause the motors were tripping the overcurrent.
[19:41:43] <rayh> Even though there was no shorted motor.
[19:41:57] <SWPLinux> oh right - there has been some discussion of overeager OC detection
[19:42:20] <SWPLinux> there's an easy fix for that, which they'll do for you if you ask, I think
[19:42:55] <SWPLinux> I'm not positive, but I think Mariss changed the OC limit for future boards as well
[19:44:23] <rayh> Easy fix if you don't mind shipping and 15 days turn around.
[19:44:53] <rayh> and suffer through his arrogant diatribe for imagined errors you made.
[19:45:02] <rayh> </rand>
[19:45:07] <rayh> rant
[19:46:40] <SWPLinux> heh
[19:46:39] <robin_sz> random rant?
[19:49:02] <A-L-P-H-A> rayh, where't the <rand> start?
[19:49:56] <rayh> Easy fix...
[19:50:30] <robin_sz> SWPLinux, I think hes using an old arc welder as the PSU for his machine. AFAIK they *usually* use an inductor for the output smoothing, so I would expect it to be saggy
[19:57:39] <tomp_> pyvcp_widgets.py has buttons suited to halpins type IO see pic of demo http://imagebin.org/7022 xml4demo http://pastebin.ca/329472 pyvcp_widgets.py4demo http://pastebin.ca/329474
[19:57:45] <tomp_> lemme know :)
[19:58:18] <tomp_> awallin: buzz!
[20:00:05] <awallin> hi tomp_
[20:00:48] <tomp_> awallin: plz check the newer pyvcp_widgets, maybe try the new checkbuttons for pins of type IO, see above maybe 3 or 4 lines
[20:03:39] <tomp_> btw: the original checkbuttons are still there ( but i added the larger frame and text ), just specify them as <btnType>Opin</btnType>
[20:03:51] <awallin> tomp_: you should probably get cvs access from cradek...
[20:06:16] <tomp_> ok, meanwhile I'll just publicize here, 'scusa
[20:15:57] <CIA-8> 03alex_joni 07v2_1_branch * 10emc2/debian/emc2.files.in: install emcmkdesktop
[20:16:00] <CIA-8> 03alex_joni 07v2_1_branch * 10emc2/src/Makefile: install emcmkdesktop
[20:18:50] <fjungclaus-away> fjungclaus-away is now known as fjungclaus
[20:25:11] <CIA-8> 03alex_joni 07TRUNK * 10emc2/src/Makefile: install emcmkdesktop
[20:26:06] <alex_joni> http://www.skyeye.org/index.shtml <- interesting
[20:31:46] <anonimasu> new 22" screen today :)
[20:32:24] <anonimasu> robin_sz: that's hardly the issue, my rectifier cant keep up with what the motors demand..
[20:32:28] <Dallur> anonimasu: gratz, the only bad thing is you will never be able to go back :D
[20:32:29] <lerneaen_hydra> anybody here run featurecam?
[20:32:28] <awallin> wow, how many pixels and how many $
[20:32:38] <anonimasu> Dallur: I still have a 19" at work..
[20:32:42] <anonimasu> something like 400eur
[20:32:54] <Dallur> anonimasu: samsung ?
[20:32:54] <lerneaen_hydra> anonimasu; crt?
[20:32:57] <anonimasu> or 450no
[20:33:00] <anonimasu> viewsonic
[20:33:03] <Dallur> nice
[20:33:06] <anonimasu> I traded my samsung syncmaster for it..
[20:33:30] <lerneaen_hydra> ooh, I have a syncmaster too, it's really good, if a bit small (17")
[20:33:31] <Dallur> anonimasu: I recently got a SyncMaster 225BW and I'm really happy
[20:33:35] <lerneaen_hydra> I have two monitors though
[20:33:38] <anonimasu> I was really happy with it :)
[20:33:43] <lerneaen_hydra> IMO better than one large one
[20:33:43] <anonimasu> but this one is better..
[20:34:16] <awallin> I sold my 20" viewsonic (1600x1200) when I got a laptop (14.1" 1400x1050)...
[20:34:38] <anonimasu> :)
[20:34:59] <anonimasu> only problem is I'll need to buy another one for work..
[20:35:05] <anonimasu> my 19" will feel small
[20:35:34] <anonimasu> awallin: this one is as bright as the samsung was
[20:35:45] <anonimasu> more contrast I think
[20:35:56] <alex_joni> I still have my Multiscan20SE :)
[20:35:58] <alex_joni> ancient but works great
[20:36:17] <anonimasu> yeah
[20:36:27] <robin_sz> anonimasu, so .. what current have you measured being drawn from the supply then?
[20:36:31] <alex_joni> 1995 it seems :)
[20:36:55] <anonimasu> I didnt measure the current I looked at it dropping..
[20:37:00] <anonimasu> the voltage that is..
[20:37:24] <robin_sz> well, the first thing you need to do is measure the current ...
[20:37:37] <anonimasu> first thing I need to do is to put another rectifier there..
[20:37:45] <robin_sz> my guess is that its MUCH less than you think it is
[20:37:48] <SWPLinux> anonimasu: what's the capacitance on the bridge output?
[20:37:55] <anonimasu> I've forgot the specs, but I were pondering it it were small when I put it there..
[20:38:08] <anonimasu> SWPLinux: I dont think I have thoose specs..
[20:38:11] <SWPLinux> actually, you have a problem with capacitance ebing too high as well
[20:38:30] <anonimasu> I hooked up a 12V supply in paralell..
[20:38:35] <anonimasu> err series..
[20:39:00] <robin_sz> and?
[20:39:07] <anonimasu> it works..
[20:39:19] <anonimasu> but I'm going to find the other rectifier and put it there..
[20:39:22] <robin_sz> does the 12V supply have a current meter?
[20:39:25] <anonimasu> yes..
[20:39:30] <robin_sz> and what did it say?
[20:39:40] <anonimasu> something like 9A
[20:39:47] <anonimasu> when moving all axes..
[20:39:59] <robin_sz> so, the final voltage is?
[20:40:04] <anonimasu> 83v
[20:40:08] <anonimasu> stable..
[20:40:10] <robin_sz> on geckos?
[20:40:13] <anonimasu> yeah
[20:40:19] <robin_sz> 83V on geckos?
[20:40:42] <robin_sz> * robin_sz sends out for more smoke
[20:41:36] <lerneaen_hydra> 83V 9A?
[20:41:39] <robin_sz> so a 500VA toroid would do it
[20:41:46] <anonimasu> I have 3 drives..
[20:42:05] <robin_sz> servos I presume
[20:42:08] <anonimasu> that's on a G0 with x0yz0
[20:42:11] <anonimasu> yeah 2 servo axes and a stepper axis..
[20:42:47] <robin_sz> unlikely the stepper pulls more than 2A
[20:43:02] <anonimasu> 4.5A per motor..
[20:43:05] <anonimasu> sounds about right..
[20:43:13] <anonimasu> for the servos..
[20:43:19] <robin_sz> yeah
[20:43:33] <robin_sz> a 500VA toroid would do it
[20:43:37] <anonimasu> yeah..
[20:43:54] <alex_joni> 500VA is not quite small
[20:44:01] <alex_joni> not big either :)
[20:44:07] <robin_sz> its "normal"
[20:44:11] <alex_joni> yeah
[20:44:19] <anonimasu> I'm sure it'll work once I find the other rectifier..
[20:44:30] <robin_sz> remember my friend and I made audio amps up to 3kw .. with toroids
[20:45:56] <robin_sz> 500VA is fairly trivial ... and the grate thing about toroids is their ability to handle short term overload
[20:46:06] <anonimasu> yeah, but I dont have a place to get one at..
[20:46:19] <anonimasu> the ones I can buy are at 230V out
[20:46:31] <robin_sz> I'll post you one :)
[20:46:47] <anonimasu> nice!
[20:47:09] <robin_sz> I'm pretty sure we have a bunch of them under Andys bench
[20:47:14] <anonimasu> :)
[20:47:22] <robin_sz> 220V in , right?
[20:47:24] <anonimasu> yeah
[20:47:29] <robin_sz> and what DC out?
[20:47:49] <robin_sz> 75V?
[20:47:52] <anonimasu> 48-75V out.
[20:47:53] <anonimasu> yeah
[20:48:59] <robin_sz> I'll have Andy wind you one .. he owes me a favour or two :)
[20:49:03] <anonimasu> :)
[20:49:24] <robin_sz> actually, I owe him a forklift truck .. but heh, it should balance up :)
[20:49:31] <anonimasu> haha
[20:50:03] <anonimasu> I'm doing 4 times the accel my Z could do before now
[20:50:19] <anonimasu> so i may actually do 3d contouring
[20:50:27] <robin_sz> right
[20:50:40] <anonimasu> feels more like a real machine now that Z isnt as crippled
[20:51:06] <robin_sz> you might find the servos are happy on less volts, the stepper on 70?
[20:51:14] <robin_sz> or a better stepper :)
[20:51:26] <anonimasu> yeah, I'm going servo on that axis too..
[20:51:33] <robin_sz> right
[20:51:35] <anonimasu> but the servos costs about 500eur..
[20:51:40] <anonimasu> so it'll be a while :)
[20:51:50] <anonimasu> got too much other stuff that takes priority
[21:00:10] <_tarzan_> anonimasu: use a homemade cylinder
[21:01:15] <anonimasu> _tarzan_: what for?
[21:02:06] <_tarzan_> for motion on an axis
[21:02:40] <anonimasu> the pwm valves costs about as much as a servo..
[21:02:41] <anonimasu> and precision would suck
[21:03:56] <rayh> those proportional hydraulic valves are a bitch to setup and tune.
[21:04:27] <anonimasu> you need current regulated outputs for them to be useable..
[21:04:57] <anonimasu> :)
[21:05:08] <rayh> and then some. I've worked on several hydraulic driven machines.
[21:05:28] <anonimasu> yep
[21:06:34] <rayh> I've still got some of the old Moog air over hydraulic setups.
[21:06:58] <anonimasu> :)
[21:07:07] <anonimasu> are thoose still in use?
[21:07:14] <rayh> You need them?
[21:07:27] <anonimasu> what do you mean?
[21:08:14] <rayh> I do not need them.
[21:08:26] <anonimasu> im in north sweden :/
[21:09:01] <SWPadnos> borrow Dallur's boat when he's done
[21:09:02] <rayh> I'll put a set in the luggage for the next trip to DE.
[21:09:16] <rayh> there you go.
[21:09:19] <anonimasu> hehe, I dont need them :)
[21:09:23] <anonimasu> rayh: thanks anyway
[21:09:45] <rayh> Okay. probably the scrap yard needs them.
[21:24:32] <awallin> anyone know how to render lines in vtk?
[21:25:35] <fenn> vtkLineSource?
[21:25:55] <awallin> can you point me to an example?
[21:26:25] <anonimasu> fenn: are you familiar with geckos?
[21:36:33] <fenn> no
[21:37:22] <awallin> fenn: do you know how to render multiple lines, i.e. a path which starts at one point and goes through many points. seems unneccessary to have to create as many actors as line segments
[21:37:24] <fenn> awallin: http://fenn.dyndns.org/pub/irc/vtk-line.py
[21:37:32] <fenn> that's one line
[21:37:42] <fenn> i know there's a way to make a line path, or at least a streamer
[21:38:08] <fenn> i got stuck on a similar problem, how to make a surface from an array
[21:39:01] <anonimasu> fenn: ok
[21:39:06] <awallin> I wonder if there's an irc channel for vtk
[21:39:08] <anonimasu> no
[21:39:29] <anonimasu> yes.
[21:39:31] <awallin> anonimasu: I use geckos on the bf-20 right now, but I don't know very much about them
[21:39:33] <anonimasu> http://public.kitware.com/pipermail/vtk-developers/2002-October/001968.html
[21:39:43] <anonimasu> I found what im looking for..
[21:39:47] <anonimasu> I need to find the other rectifier
[21:39:56] <anonimasu> overvoltage will kill them fast..
[21:40:06] <anonimasu> anything over 80v apparently
[21:40:13] <anonimasu> irc.openprojects.net on the #vtk channel.
[21:40:41] <fenn> this is openprojects.net
[21:40:52] <anonimasu> are you sure?
[21:41:05] <fenn> it used to be
[21:41:14] <anonimasu> yeah but as #vtk is empty
[21:41:20] <alex_joni> irc.openprojects.org ?
[21:41:25] <alex_joni> err.. net
[21:41:30] <alex_joni> is it linked to freenode ?
[21:41:55] <fenn> the name was changed a couple years ago
[21:41:57] <awallin> irc.openprojects.net: couldn't connect to host
[21:42:06] <alex_joni> fenn: oh right
[21:42:21] <alex_joni> when lilo had a fight with someone else I can't remember
[21:42:26] <alex_joni> I think I read about it
[21:42:32] <alex_joni> but that was 5 years ago or such
[21:43:01] <fenn> http://lwn.net/Articles/68374/ <- some history
[21:43:09] <awallin> so no vtk channel then...
[21:43:50] <alex_joni> awallin: I suggest you start one :D
[21:44:21] <fenn> :(
[21:44:23] <fenn> ChanServ removes channel operator status from fenn
[21:45:24] <anonimasu> somone needs to buy that book
[21:45:32] <anonimasu> "VTK Textbook"
[21:45:46] <fenn> ;)
[21:45:53] <awallin> and/or userguide...
[21:45:58] <anonimasu> yeah
[21:46:03] <anonimasu> hm..
[21:46:05] <awallin> I copied the first part of the 4.2 userguide
[21:46:15] <awallin> but it doesn't contain everything
[21:46:37] <anonimasu> hm, you cant buy it in sweden :/
[21:46:40] <anonimasu> the textbook..
[21:46:44] <robin_sz> hes dead you know, lilo
[21:46:52] <fenn> is the userguide on the vtk website?
[21:47:07] <awallin> they are only for sale
[21:47:23] <anonimasu> yep
[21:47:40] <fenn> i ran across something written be lilo totally randomly yesterday
[21:48:03] <fenn> i'm reading this book "accelerando" and had to look up the word "agalmic"
[21:48:08] <fenn> turns out its a word lilo made up
[21:56:40] <jepler> http://web.archive.org/web/20030623204916/freenode.net/faq.shtml#namechange
[21:57:02] <lerman_> lerman_ is now known as lerman
[22:00:03] <SWPadnos> man - look at how clean this shop is: http://www.preci.com/photos.htm
[22:00:22] <SWPadnos> I think that's cleaner than our dining room
[22:00:38] <jepler> yeah right I'm sure it's like that EVERY DAY
[22:00:48] <jepler> and not just on the day that it was preannounced they'd be taking photographs
[22:00:51] <SWPadnos> it was when I visited ...
[22:01:01] <jepler> oh really?
[22:01:07] <SWPadnos> yep
[22:01:27] <SWPadnos> that's where my lathe is coming from
[22:01:40] <SWPadnos> I was surprised, to say the least
[22:03:17] <SWPadnos> ah ha - I see some oil on the floor in one photo
[22:04:42] <ejholmgren> hesus ...
[22:04:52] <ejholmgren> that's fawking clean
[22:05:10] <SWPadnos> heh - yep
[22:05:23] <Dallur> they might just be the only iso certified company in the world that follows the book :P
[22:05:40] <alex_joni> Dallur: iso is not about cleanness
[22:05:42] <alex_joni> :P
[22:05:47] <SWPadnos> well, I guess I'm lucky to get a fully functional NC lathe from them for $500 then, huh? :)
[22:06:02] <SWPadnos> (and that they're only ~5 miles from my house)
[22:06:56] <Dallur> alex: yahh but if your place is that clean they apparently have plenty of spare time ...
[22:07:06] <alex_joni> haha
[22:07:40] <anonimasu> hm, there's this shop here with the same cleanliness..
[22:08:01] <anonimasu> :)
[22:08:19] <anonimasu> I've never managed to keep it that clean around a machine
[22:08:22] <robin_sz> weird
[22:08:25] <robin_sz> nice shop
[22:08:28] <robin_sz> ver clean
[22:08:29] <anonimasu> yeah
[22:08:32] <ejholmgren> maybe they modded a roomba with ginormous servos ...
[22:08:33] <robin_sz> but ...
[22:08:35] <anonimasu> I'd love to have it like that
[22:08:41] <robin_sz> can you see any actual product anywhere?
[22:08:52] <anonimasu> if you have enclosures around your machines it should be easier
[22:09:01] <SWPadnos> when I was there, they were making small stuff, like titanium screws for military/aerospace stuff
[22:09:31] <SWPadnos> so you wouldn't necessarily see it in the photos
[22:09:32] <robin_sz> right
[22:09:45] <robin_sz> we did some aerospace this week?
[22:09:47] <robin_sz> :)
[22:09:54] <robin_sz> bending some Ti sheet
[22:10:09] <fenn> there's a new roomba for "shops" - well, probably intended for your average suburban woodworking basement, but still
[22:10:07] <robin_sz> inthat rollaV tooling
[22:10:19] <SWPadnos> the egg-carton trays are likely full of product ...
[22:10:42] <robin_sz> just trial stuff for Airbus, but fun all the same .. surrounds for the front windscreens apparntly
[22:11:41] <ejholmgren> * ejholmgren dances around in a nyquil daze
[22:11:42] <SWPadnos> ahm so it's your fault they're behind schedule? ;)
[22:11:45] <robin_sz> heh
[22:11:51] <anonimasu> hehe
[22:12:07] <SWPadnos> son't they know the windshields need to be transparent???
[22:12:12] <ejholmgren> raid1 is finally up ... said screw hardware raid with a shitty controller and just did software instead
[22:12:21] <alex_joni> SWPadnos: no.. it's TFT on the inside
[22:12:28] <robin_sz> software raid works fine
[22:12:30] <SWPadnos> heh
[22:12:38] <alex_joni> ejholmgren: screwing raid controllers is not always fun
[22:12:45] <SWPadnos> TMI
[22:12:46] <Dallur> robin_sz when news reaches us that a front windscreen from an Airbus 380 popped out and sucked the pilots out we will know who to talk to :D
[22:12:54] <anonimasu> hm, :D
[22:12:55] <robin_sz> heh
[22:13:11] <robin_sz> Dallur, thankfully, our work was just trials to prove the tooling
[22:13:22] <alex_joni> the actual work will be on bending glass
[22:13:22] <alex_joni> :D
[22:13:28] <robin_sz> did get to bend real Ti though
[22:14:14] <jepler> is bending Ti like bending glass? I guess I don't understand why you'd use Ti to prove the tooling.
[22:14:43] <robin_sz> why do you tink this has anythng to do with bending glass?
[22:14:53] <robin_sz> * robin_sz is unsure where the glass thing started
[22:14:57] <alex_joni> someone started about windshields
[22:15:03] <jepler> forget it
[22:15:03] <robin_sz> just trial stuff for Airbus, but fun all the same .. surrounds for the front windscreens apparntly
[22:15:08] <SWPadnos> heh
[22:15:11] <robin_sz> "surrounds" ...
[22:15:16] <jepler> I got confused by all the other people who mentioned glass -- that's my story and I'm sticking with it
[22:15:20] <robin_sz> heh
[22:15:21] <SWPadnos> my fault, I guess :)
[22:15:23] <alex_joni> SWPadnos was it
[22:15:31] <SWPadnos> how thick was the Ti?
[22:15:36] <robin_sz> 1.6mm
[22:15:43] <SWPadnos> oh - tiny stuff
[22:15:43] <robin_sz> very weird to bend
[22:15:55] <robin_sz> you know what springback is?
[22:16:24] <robin_sz> where you overbend, and the metal springs back to the desired angle
[22:16:33] <robin_sz> its about 4 degrees in mild steel
[22:16:37] <SWPadnos> yep
[22:16:41] <robin_sz> so you bend to 94, it springs back to 90
[22:16:54] <robin_sz> well .. Ti is about 24 degrees
[22:17:02] <SWPadnos> ouch
[22:17:08] <anonimasu> what a pain
[22:17:19] <robin_sz> this was a 38mm radius we had to bend
[22:17:25] <robin_sz> +- almost nothing
[22:18:32] <robin_sz> lots of fun though
[22:18:47] <robin_sz> workshop full of suits :)
[22:19:13] <anonimasu> hehe
[22:19:25] <SWPadnos> CIA seems to be sleeping again
[22:19:35] <robin_sz> they never sleep!
[22:20:28] <anonimasu> :)
[22:25:12] <CIA> we never sleep
[22:25:19] <SWPadnos> heh
[22:25:29] <SWPadnos> nice one Alex :)
[22:25:33] <alex_joni> :P
[22:25:52] <alex_joni> should have used my cia ssh account
[22:26:03] <alex_joni> but I like to keep that for needy days
[22:28:04] <CIA-8> 03alex_joni 07v2_1_branch * 10emc2/configs/dallur-thc/dallur-advanced.ini: fix ini names, otherwise multiple Desktop links are confusing
[22:28:04] <CIA-8> 03alex_joni 07v2_1_branch * 10emc2/configs/demo_sim_cl/demo_sim_cl.ini: fix ini names, otherwise multiple Desktop links are confusing
[22:28:04] <CIA-8> 03alex_joni 07v2_1_branch * 10emc2/configs/etch-servo/etch.ini: fix ini names, otherwise multiple Desktop links are confusing
[22:28:05] <CIA-8> 03alex_joni 07v2_1_branch * 10emc2/configs/halui_halvcp/halui.ini: fix ini names, otherwise multiple Desktop links are confusing
[22:28:09] <CIA-8> 03alex_joni 07v2_1_branch * 10emc2/configs/max/max.ini: fix ini names, otherwise multiple Desktop links are confusing
[22:28:12] <CIA-8> 03alex_joni 07v2_1_branch * 10emc2/configs/m5i20/m5i20.ini: fix ini names, otherwise multiple Desktop links are confusing
[22:28:15] <CIA-8> 03alex_joni 07v2_1_branch * 10emc2/configs/motenc/motenc.ini: fix ini names, otherwise multiple Desktop links are confusing
[22:28:18] <CIA-8> 03alex_joni 07v2_1_branch * 10emc2/configs/nist-lathe/inch.ini: fix ini names, otherwise multiple Desktop links are confusing
[22:28:21] <CIA-8> 03alex_joni 07v2_1_branch * 10emc2/configs/ppmc/ppmc.ini: fix ini names, otherwise multiple Desktop links are confusing
[22:28:24] <CIA-8> 03alex_joni 07v2_1_branch * 10emc2/configs/stepper/sim_inch.ini: fix ini names, otherwise multiple Desktop links are confusing
[22:28:27] <CIA-8> 03alex_joni 07v2_1_branch * 10emc2/configs/stepper-xyza/inch.ini: fix ini names, otherwise multiple Desktop links are confusing
[22:28:52] <CIA-8> 03alex_joni 07v2_1_branch * 10emc2/configs/sim/ (7 files): fix ini names, otherwise multiple Desktop links are confusing
[22:28:52] <CIA-8> 03alex_joni 07v2_1_branch * 10emc2/configs/univpwm/univpwm.ini: fix ini names, otherwise multiple Desktop links are confusing
[22:28:52] <CIA-8> 03alex_joni 07v2_1_branch * 10emc2/configs/univstep/univstep.ini: fix ini names, otherwise multiple Desktop links are confusing
[22:29:21] <CIA-8> 03alex_joni 07TRUNK * 10emc2/configs/dallur-thc/dallur-advanced.ini: fix ini names, otherwise multiple Desktop links are confusing
[22:29:20] <CIA-8> 03alex_joni 07TRUNK * 10emc2/configs/demo_sim_cl/demo_sim_cl.ini: fix ini names, otherwise multiple Desktop links are confusing
[22:29:20] <CIA-8> 03alex_joni 07TRUNK * 10emc2/configs/etch-servo/etch.ini: fix ini names, otherwise multiple Desktop links are confusing
[22:29:21] <CIA-8> 03alex_joni 07TRUNK * 10emc2/configs/halui_halvcp/halui.ini: fix ini names, otherwise multiple Desktop links are confusing
[22:29:26] <CIA-8> 03alex_joni 07TRUNK * 10emc2/configs/max/max.ini: fix ini names, otherwise multiple Desktop links are confusing
[22:29:29] <CIA-8> 03alex_joni 07TRUNK * 10emc2/configs/m5i20/m5i20.ini: fix ini names, otherwise multiple Desktop links are confusing
[22:29:32] <CIA-8> 03alex_joni 07TRUNK * 10emc2/configs/motenc/motenc.ini: fix ini names, otherwise multiple Desktop links are confusing
[22:29:35] <CIA-8> 03alex_joni 07TRUNK * 10emc2/configs/nist-lathe/inch.ini: fix ini names, otherwise multiple Desktop links are confusing
[22:29:38] <CIA-8> 03alex_joni 07TRUNK * 10emc2/configs/ppmc/ppmc.ini: fix ini names, otherwise multiple Desktop links are confusing
[22:29:43] <CIA-8> 03alex_joni 07TRUNK * 10emc2/configs/sim/ (7 files): fix ini names, otherwise multiple Desktop links are confusing
[22:29:44] <CIA-8> 03alex_joni 07TRUNK * 10emc2/configs/stepper-xyza/inch.ini: fix ini names, otherwise multiple Desktop links are confusing
[22:29:49] <CIA-8> 03alex_joni 07TRUNK * 10emc2/configs/univpwm/univpwm.ini: fix ini names, otherwise multiple Desktop links are confusing
[22:29:52] <CIA-8> 03alex_joni 07TRUNK * 10emc2/configs/univstep/univstep.ini: fix ini names, otherwise multiple Desktop links are confusing
[22:29:55] <CIA-8> 03alex_joni 07TRUNK * 10emc2/configs/stepper/sim_inch.ini: fix ini names, otherwise multiple Desktop links are confusing
[22:30:05] <anonimasu> * anonimasu jumps into the boat
[22:30:36] <alex_joni> too late
[22:30:40] <alex_joni> :(
[22:33:53] <K`zan> gurgle<wave...> :-)
[22:33:57] <cradek> Unlike many patent applications, the Apparatus for Facilitating the Birth of a Child by Centrifugal Force is described in great detail
[22:34:14] <lerneaen_hydra> ... wtf?
[22:34:28] <K`zan> LOL
[22:35:06] <Dallur> cradek: so we are not supposed to get pregnant women near our lathes ?
[22:35:38] <cradek> you have to wonder if they made a prototype
[22:36:00] <alex_joni> cradek: ROFL
[22:36:10] <Dallur> I want to know how they did testing ......
[22:36:11] <lerneaen_hydra> I'd wonder where they managed to get alpha-testers
[23:03:45] <robin_sz> herem
[23:03:51] <robin_sz> this is funny
[23:03:53] <robin_sz> http://www.porkolt.com/funny/girl/fights/guy/owned/lift/girl-fights-back-guy-gets-owned-14599.html
[23:07:41] <lerneaen_hydra> 'night
[23:07:48] <Dallur> nite LH
[23:08:44] <SWPadnos> egad: http://www.porkolt.com/funny/america/talent/show/illusionist/change/clothes/i-change-clothes-6217.html
[23:09:28] <alex_joni> http://www.porkolt.com/funny/supid/cat/walk/stupid-cat-again-5106.html
[23:11:12] <SWPadnos> that's not very nice :(
[23:11:13] <robin_sz> heheh
[23:11:30] <A-L-P-H-A> how do they change so quick????
[23:11:37] <SWPadnos> damned if I know
[23:11:40] <A-L-P-H-A> WOW!
[23:11:44] <anonimasu> hehe
[23:11:44] <A-L-P-H-A> that's sooo cool!
[23:11:54] <SWPadnos> and it looked like Beyonce (or whoever that was) and David Hasselhoff couldn't tell either
[23:12:25] <Dallur> both of them are identical twins and their brother/sister changes behind the screen and they switch
[23:12:39] <A-L-P-H-A> poor cat.
[23:12:39] <SWPadnos> could be
[23:12:51] <alex_joni> they even change hair colour at one point :)
[23:12:53] <A-L-P-H-A> imagine how muchit'd hurt the cat to take the tape off. :(
[23:13:07] <A-L-P-H-A> alex_joni, that's a wig... but still.
[23:13:41] <A-L-P-H-A> freak'n poor cat.
[23:14:26] <alex_joni> * alex_joni has got to try that
[23:16:31] <alex_joni> I'm off to bed.. good night all
[23:16:33] <A-L-P-H-A> alex_joni, don't tape yourself.
[23:16:51] <A-L-P-H-A> you'll just pull the hairs off your armpit.
[23:16:57] <Dallur> night alex
[23:16:59] <erDiZz> that's... controversal I'd say
[23:18:04] <A-L-P-H-A> shit... my GF is going to be pissed at me, as I'm going to be late now, after watching those vids.
[23:19:54] <robin_sz> well .. thats japanese humour for you]
[23:21:21] <anonimasu> yeah..
[23:21:26] <anonimasu> did anyone see the punshment game(japaneese video)
[23:21:50] <SWPadnos> I saw the Saturday Night Live thing
[23:22:23] <SWPadnos> with Chris Farley, Alec Baldwin, Mike Meyers, and a couple of others
[23:23:07] <anonimasu> this is some random japaneese guys
[23:23:15] <anonimasu> http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ZXq4r1vmwh4
[23:23:17] <anonimasu> not the right one
[23:23:28] <anonimasu> http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=LdgdBOTUSqg&mode=related&search=
[23:23:30] <anonimasu> there..
[23:23:32] <robin_sz> seen the "toilet on a scissor lift" one?
[23:23:43] <anonimasu> yeah
[23:23:58] <anonimasu> that last one is hillarious
[23:23:59] <robin_sz> knda crazy
[23:24:46] <anonimasu> yeah
[23:25:30] <anonimasu> I like the massage chair clip
[23:25:39] <anonimasu> where they shoot the chair out in to the skiing slope
[23:35:23] <anonimasu> freenode died.
[23:37:37] <robin_sz> japanese humour ... http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=aEKqU1fkYCI
[23:44:20] <anonimasu> did you see that movie I pasted you?
[23:48:13] <robin_sz> yeah, amazing ...
[23:49:41] <robin_sz> twins too
[23:56:52] <K`zan> if you liked that watch MXC on Spike (cable).
[23:57:02] <K`zan> AKA Taki's Castle...
[23:57:12] <K`zan> Weird enough :-).