#emc | Logs for 2012-01-01

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[04:58:39] <clytle374> happy new year to for everyone west of USA eastern time zone
[04:58:56] <clytle374> Anyone sober enough to answer a question?
[04:59:56] <cjdavis> Happy New Year!
[05:00:34] <clytle374> oops, east of... And I'm sober, no wonder I have questions
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[05:11:16] <elmo401> Happy GNU year :)
[05:12:49] <capricorn_one> Happy New Year!
[05:16:24] <clytle374> Does dmesg not give a correct pin out? the hostmot2 5i20 servo example on shows 2 encoders.
[05:16:39] <clytle374> when it states 3 in the config
[05:33:53] <clytle374> it only gives P2-01 thru P2-27 odd.
[05:36:45] <clytle374> and my paths aren't all being used when I log in with ssh.
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[05:44:25] <clytle374> well the ssh path is normal, learned something today. Goon night and happy new year everyone
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[09:44:02] <Loetmichel> mornin' and a happy new year!
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[10:03:36] <motioncontrol> Good year at all, with more cheers for family, more seremity and business.Good 1012.
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[10:27:15] <Loetmichel> hmmm... there are time when i appreciate the BandSaw. That would have lasted forever with a hacksaw... and 2 minutes with the machine ;-) -> http://www.cyrom.org/palbum/main.php?g2_itemId=12641
[10:27:51] <Loetmichel> 40mm aluminium for a new standoff on the Wheelchair of my wife
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[10:54:52] <Loetmichel> *grrr* now i would have use for a 3d cad and a postprocessor ;-)
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[12:34:47] <jthornton> I don't see anything on that part that needs 3d cad and a postprocessor
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[13:06:21] <mazafaka> how bandsaw differs from hacksaw?
[13:07:50] <Jymmm> When the blade breaks, it'll take your face and hands with it
[13:09:06] <mazafaka> not at all, it just stops to move. I used horizontal bandsaws alot
[13:09:29] <mazafaka> (I used wikipedia to find what they are)
[13:09:59] <mazafaka> jthornton: What do you think of my last words about the wood stove?
[13:12:23] <jthornton> I think what ever scheme works for you is the best way to do it
[13:13:44] <mazafaka> i thought of not spending too much of the Earth's resources, you know
[13:15:23] <jthornton> I guess that depends on your location and the sustainability of those resources if you mean the wood your burning.
[13:16:53] <mazafaka> it can be -40 celsius, but about -7...-9 this time
[13:17:34] <mazafaka> deadliest cold when you can not actually squeeze the door key properly
[13:21:17] <jthornton> yes, I'm familiar with -35c temperatures in the state where I was born and raised we lived in the temperate part where the winters were sort of mild compared to the rest of the state
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[13:41:54] <mazafaka> plan to buy tall Russian SUV which is too high for my garage. I will have to put off the soft top when I want to put it into the garage. Could buy one more garage...
[13:43:32] <mazafaka> Like this http://valentina19.www.nn.ru/users/foto/215991-2010-10-08-120639.3102.jpg but used one, for about USD 1800 and spend another USD 2000 onto it withing the year.
[13:49:24] <jthornton> kinda like a basic jeep knock off
[13:49:31] <jthornton> gas engine?
[13:51:59] <Mjolinor> live axels :o
[13:52:15] <Mjolinor> or even axles
[13:52:50] <mazafaka> unconvinient for jeep gasoline engine
[13:53:10] <mazafaka> spends about 10-11 up to 16-17 litres per 100 km
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[14:08:34] <pccnc> hey JT-Shop, happy new year...
[14:10:01] <pccnc> i am using thc comp.. finally its working. but i have 2 issues...Z goes up whenever i abort the running program or it finishes smoothly...i read on forums and downloaded latest 2.4.7 source code but still same problem is there...
[14:10:11] <pccnc> can you give me GIT link with up to date thc comp???
[14:10:56] <pccnc> one more thing z axis is moving to correct posiition but AXIS GUI doesnt show any changes in Z...
[14:11:03] <pccnc> i think both are related to same...
[14:11:45] <pccnc> another question is should i use F+ or F- i am using MESA 7I43 and modified HAL file accordingly
[14:15:49] <pccnc> anyone here??
[14:34:07] <cpresser> pccnc: the reason you dont see the changed position in axis is based on how the comp works
[14:34:54] <cpresser> since the comp does not change the position defined via gcode, but rather adds/sustracts values to the commanded position, you wont see this in axis
[14:35:11] <cpresser> but you are free to add a pyvcp-widget displaying the involved hal-values
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[14:49:41] <pccnc> thanks cpresser... but cant we make to change actual position???
[14:50:04] <pccnc> actually i dont have knowledge or hal programming.. and what about jumps at end of motion
[15:00:19] <cpresser> why would you want to change the programmed position?
[15:00:36] <JT-Shop> adding to what cpresser said are you moving the Z in a positive direction after cutting to remove any offset?
[15:00:38] <cpresser> if you want to change that, change the program :)
[15:01:12] <JT-Shop> and as I said before 2.4.7 is the latest version of the thc.comp iirc
[15:03:11] <JT-Shop> this is the git link http://git.linuxcnc.org/gitweb
[15:04:46] <JT-Shop> the thc history http://git.linuxcnc.org/gitweb?p=emc2.git;a=history;f=src/hal/components/thc.comp;h=1afa4acfb63567eff604d9b7694c085a833e4928;hb=HEAD
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[15:07:31] <pcw_home> F+ or F- are just inverted from each other. they both have the same frequency so if tiy use it single ended either will work
[15:07:33] <pcw_home> Its a differential output so if you have noise problems or need to go a long way with the signal you can use a differential receiver
[15:08:49] <JT-Shop> Hi Peter!
[15:09:01] <pcw_home> HNY JT
[15:09:10] <JT-Shop> HNY
[15:09:28] <JT-Shop> I forget F- F+ are on the THCAD card?
[15:09:38] <pcw_home> Yes
[15:11:06] <pcw_home> So if its 50 feet or so from the computer you use a differential receiver(encoder input probably)
[15:12:00] <JT-Shop> so, I'm safe the THCAD card is <12" from the 7i76 card :)
[15:12:16] <JT-Shop> I need to get that change over done soon
[15:13:00] <JT-Shop> pccnc: ^^
[15:22:08] <emcrules> JT-Shop: did you get my message?
[15:29:40] <pccnc> JT-Shop, i am not moviing anything.. if i press ESC.. Z jups UPside...
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[15:36:52] <JT-Shop> emcrules: yes, I need to look in mine but I have 3 start caps
[15:37:59] <JT-Shop> pccnc: yes, that is a short coming with the thc comp when you hit ESC the Z will travel to the EMC commanded position
[15:38:03] <JT-Shop> at a rapid rate
[15:38:35] <pccnc> is there any workaround for this???
[15:38:36] <JT-Shop> pccnc: do you do a Z up move at the end of your cut?
[15:38:49] <pccnc> may be let me check it...
[15:39:05] <pccnc> m using different pc...
[15:39:20] <JT-Shop> you MUST move Z up at the end of the cut after the torch is off or the offset will not get removed
[15:40:53] <JT-Shop> the only workaround is to get someone smarter than me to look at the thc comp...
[15:42:14] <pccnc> no there is no Z word in whole program.. and i am not using Touch off.. i manually set the z than start the program with THC Enable
[15:43:10] <JT-Shop> after you turn the torch off with M5 you MUST move Z up to remove any offsets
[15:43:12] <pccnc> so may be the last jog on Z is upward +Z.. should i check it with -Z
[15:43:24] <pccnc> ok got it..
[15:43:34] <pccnc> how many MM should i move z up???
[15:43:34] <pcw_home> Wouldnt you want Z up when you are done anyway (for maximum torch clearance?)
[15:43:44] <JT-Shop> I do
[15:43:58] <JT-Shop> to clear tip ups when traversing to next cut
[15:44:32] <pccnc> you mean everytime i use M5 i need to move z up right?? any specific value ???
[15:46:18] <pccnc> pcw_home: my frequency fluctuates sometime.. is it normal ?? i am plannic to put THCAD in Plasma unit itself? my HyperTherm have space.. and than use differential signal to eliminate noise... is there any prblem if i put THCAD in Plasma unit???
[15:46:20] <JT-Shop> yep, any offset will get removed at the rate of change per cycle so the distance depends on how much offset, direction of offset and rate of change. So I can't say a value
[15:47:01] <pccnc> pcw_home: distance between Plasma and THCAD is 8-10feet.. and plasma gives 7.5volt max...
[15:47:24] <JT-Shop> I just move up to Z0
[15:47:40] <pccnc> according to specs.. but i never got higher than 3.5v while cutting.. i tried it up to 6mm thickness
[15:47:58] <pccnc> thanks JT-Shop.. i will try it..
[15:48:22] <pccnc> which plasma u use? and how many volts u get??
[15:48:59] <pccnc> and what is volt tolerence u use?? @JT-Shop
[15:49:02] <JT-Shop> I have a Hypertherm 1250
[15:49:24] <JT-Shop> I use 2.0 volts tolerance
[15:49:26] <pccnc> grt.. its similar i think.. working on 7.5v max???
[15:49:40] <pccnc> you mean 0.2
[15:49:43] <JT-Shop> my output is 0-300v
[15:50:12] <pccnc> oh ok.. i got 50:1 divider inbuilt..:(
[15:50:46] <pccnc> ok if 300v than 2v tolerence is fine.. ;)
[15:50:48] <JT-Shop> my divider provides 0-10v from the 0-300v
[15:51:10] <pccnc> and what are the actual voltage you got while cutting 5mm or less??
[15:51:29] <JT-Shop> tip voltage?
[15:51:33] <pccnc> you mean inbuilt divider or u made divider by urself??
[15:51:46] <JT-Shop> divider I made
[15:51:59] <pccnc> arc voltag i think... ODOMETER voltage ;) in pyvcp
[15:54:06] <JT-Shop> I use the recommendations from the Hypertherm manual for voltage and amps
[15:55:02] <JT-Shop> so 10ga 3.4mm 40amp 83volt 50 IPM that's 1270mm/min
[15:57:21] <JT-Shop> and my meter hovers right at the selected voltage so long as my velocity is proper for that cut
[15:58:50] <JT-Shop> if velocity is too slow due to fumble fingers or other the torch will dive into the work piece trying to get the voltage correct
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[16:04:42] * Tom_itx wonders if JT-Shop kept the neighbors up with his cannon
[16:05:49] <JT-Shop> well we did launch some tannerite missiles but that was in the afternoon
[16:07:00] <JT-Shop> pcw_home: did you say once that you thought the thc.comp could benefit from a P term instead of a rate of change? http://git.linuxcnc.org/gitweb?p=emc2.git;a=blob;f=src/hal/components/thc.comp;h=1afa4acfb63567eff604d9b7694c085a833e4928;hb=HEAD
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[16:11:30] <pcw_home> Yes, it would have better following performance (you could actually use a full PID component)
[16:16:04] <JT-Shop> something like copying the pid loop calculation from the PID component http://git.linuxcnc.org/gitweb?p=emc2.git;a=blob;f=src/hal/components/pid.c;h=8aabb87d72ffc937ddd276d3a061f84f83939e94;hb=HEAD
[16:16:28] <JT-Shop> or just some way to use the PID with I/O pins from the thc comp?
[16:17:14] <JT-Shop> crap the pid comp is 657 lines long :/
[16:19:50] <JT-Shop> I think it would be easier to just have a couple more pins on the thc comp to/from the pid comp :)
[16:20:15] <Ekkeri> what's the difference between ubuntu 10.04 & 8.04?
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[16:21:43] <JT-Shop> 8.04 might work with some older hardware when 10.04 won't
[16:21:58] <Ekkeri> it seems that it's not supported anymore
[16:22:08] <Ekkeri> so I will get the 10.04
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[16:49:28] <robin_sz> sigh .. why ... why when I write to the serial port, does write(fd, buf, lenght) return that all the buffer was written, but nothing comes out of the port?
[16:49:49] <robin_sz> maybe I need to assert RTS?
[16:51:06] <jdhNC> how do you know nothing is coming out the port?
[16:51:10] <robin_sz> doh ioctl(fd, TIOCMGET, &controlbits); ... seems TIOCMGET is not defined
[16:51:35] <robin_sz> jdhNC, logic analyser hanging on the rs485 bus
[16:52:59] <robin_sz> its actually RS232 poer with a RS485 adaptor, I have had perl scripts use the same port fine and the logic analyser captured the data, so im pretty confidents its not making its way out
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[16:53:49] <Loetmichel> hrhr...
[16:54:25] <robin_sz> I got reading from the port all sorted out, works fine
[16:55:24] <robin_sz> was using a perl script to inject commands onto the RS485, to the target device, and then my C prog was reading the response from the target just fine
[16:55:33] * Loetmichel is sitting in the bath tub, generating/editing gcode... if i had the Webcam plugged in to the MillPC i could even start the mill from here, the workpiece is clamped right in the mill ;-)
[16:55:40] <Loetmichel> ... vnc rules :-)
[16:55:42] <robin_sz> stage 2 is to send the commands from C as well
[16:56:29] <robin_sz> int count;
[16:56:29] <robin_sz> count = write(serPort,tmpBuf,ptr);
[16:56:29] <robin_sz> fprintf(stderr,"wrote %d to serial port",count);
[16:56:41] <robin_sz> and .. nothing appears on the wire :(
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[16:57:46] <robin_sz> Loetmichel, you need microphone by mill as well, so you can hear the tool snap ;)
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[16:58:33] <Mjolinor> just install the wife there, she can shout when it snaps
[16:58:36] <robin_sz> I go the laser engraver running yesterday, works fine .. but needs new lens and mirrors, too much power is being lost
[16:59:03] <robin_sz> Mjolinor, and if it hits her in the head?
[16:59:11] <robin_sz> Mjolinor, then you have to make your own coffee!
[16:59:13] <archivist> robin_sz, rs232 handshake often bites :)
[16:59:37] <robin_sz> yeah, i figure I need to raise RTS and wait for CTS ...
[16:59:47] <Mjolinor> hmm, true
[17:00:13] <Loetmichel> robin_sz: that i can see on the webcam ;-)
[17:00:15] <archivist> specially when you forgot you put it in software handshake!
[17:00:24] <Loetmichel> BTDT: http://www.cyrom.org/palbum/main.php?g2_view=core.DownloadItem&g2_itemId=12522&g2_serialNumber=2
[17:00:27] <Mjolinor> use stty to turn handshake off
[17:00:31] <robin_sz> archivist, its hw handshake ...
[17:00:49] <robin_sz> I'll try no handshake
[17:01:09] <archivist> robin_sz, the methods can co exist
[17:02:11] <Mjolinor> system ("stty -crtscts -F /dev/ttyUSB0 -hupcl -ixon -icrnl ignbrk -onlcr -opost -isig -icanon -iexten -echo -echoe -echok -echoctl -echoke 9600");
[17:02:23] <Mjolinor> that is the stty command for all off and let the data run :)
[17:03:03] <Loetmichel> sorry, wrong link ... http://www.cyrom.org/palbum/main.php?g2_itemId=12521&g2_imageViewsIndex=1
[17:03:11] <jdhNC> sys$qio() is so much nicer
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[17:08:40] <skunkKandT> Loetmichel: still in the tub? ;)
[17:09:19] <robin_sz> hmm. removing options.c_cflag |= CRTSCTS; and replacing it with options.c_cflag &= ~CRTSCTS; made it work
[17:09:31] <robin_sz> except .. swapping it back still makes it work
[17:09:37] <robin_sz> confused
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[17:15:26] <skunkKandT> fun
[17:21:28] <elmo401> sounds like it
[17:21:55] <cradek> does your hardware do rts/cts or is it 3 wire dumb?
[17:22:52] <robin_sz> rts/cts
[17:23:24] <robin_sz> rs232 ports with full feature RS485 adaptors built in
[17:23:27] <robin_sz> err
[17:23:29] <robin_sz> bolted on
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[17:23:53] <robin_sz> I assume the RTS and CTS wiggle as appropriate to indicate the bus state
[17:24:12] <elmo401> Loetmichel: I see all those G01 on every line. At 6000+ lines does it still run smoothly?
[17:24:32] <cradek> do you have to assert DTR to turn on the adaptor?
[17:25:42] <robin_sz> hmm,
[17:26:14] <robin_sz> Id like to read the state of the lines,
[17:26:34] <cradek> can you stick a 232 breakout box between the serport and adapter?
[17:26:37] <robin_sz> but TIOCMGET does not seem to be defined?
[17:27:03] <robin_sz> well, I have a logic analyser hanging on the RS285
[17:27:05] <robin_sz> 485
[17:27:14] <robin_sz> so I can see when stuff happens
[17:27:58] <cradek> I'm not sure you can read the lines themselves from software, they are on the other side of a uart
[17:28:46] <robin_sz> hmm
[17:28:56] <robin_sz> you could be right
[17:29:23] <cradek> do you have ~IXON and ~IXOFF? maybe you're getting stuck on an XOFF
[17:29:38] <robin_sz> http://www.easysw.com/~mike/serial/serial.html#table11
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[17:30:05] <robin_sz> I have disabled IXON IXOFF
[17:30:27] <robin_sz> options.c_iflag |= ~(IXON | IXOFF | IXANY); /* no software flow control */
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[17:31:14] <robin_sz> uh ... wait
[17:31:17] <cradek> that's wrong
[17:31:19] <robin_sz> that shoud be &=
[17:31:29] <cradek> yes
[17:31:31] <robin_sz> doh
[17:31:47] <Loetmichel> elmo401: it does
[17:31:55] <cradek> maybe you should use cfmakeraw instead
[17:31:59] <Loetmichel> and it was about 80k lines
[17:32:13] <cradek> oh no wait, you said you still want cts/rts
[17:32:37] <Loetmichel> had to assert G64P0.05 as first line, thou
[17:32:49] <robin_sz> seems to work
[17:32:54] <Loetmichel> (thoug? Though?)
[17:33:06] <cradek> bbl
[17:33:07] <robin_sz> I can see I will be learning about select() tonight
[17:33:34] <robin_sz> thats the only way to timeout a read() call ?
[17:34:08] <elmo401> though ;)
[17:34:25] <Loetmichel> thx
[17:34:45] <elmo401> and it should be in the beginning of the sentence. 'Though I had to assert G64.... '
[17:34:59] <Loetmichel> ah
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[17:35:19] <Loetmichel> german grammar is a bit more flexible, hence the error ;-)
[17:39:01] * JT-Shop goes to take a nap while the BP computer gets all of the updates...
[17:39:27] <JT-Shop> Step 1 install the GS2... Done
[17:40:12] <skunkKandT> bp computer?
[17:40:31] <skunkKandT> oh - the drip feeder?
[17:40:42] <JT-Shop> yea, the BP series 1 knee mill with Anilam CNC conversion kit on it
[17:40:51] <JT-Shop> converting to EMC2!
[17:41:18] <skunkKandT> ah - nice!
[17:41:27] <skunkKandT> I forgot you had a knee mill.
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[17:42:54] <JT-Shop_> which should be easy with the examples provided in the manuals :)
[17:44:01] <JT-Shop_> hmmm, these screen shots need updating for sure http://linuxcnc.org/docview/2.5/html/hal/pyvcp_examples.html#_gs2_rpm_meter_a_id_gs2_rpm_meter_a
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[18:22:20] <IchGucksLive> hi all and cheer for the new year 1
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[18:23:31] <skunkKandT> hear here! ;)
[18:25:33] <IchGucksLive> first death at Dakar 2012
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[18:27:16] <skunkKandT> morbid
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[18:27:38] <skunkKandT> we usually go by first births ;)
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[18:30:07] <elmo40> IchGucksLive: first... usually more
[18:31:46] <Tom_itx> all i recall is a biker goin by on the revlimiter and a few min later sirens
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[19:38:37] <skunkKandT> http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=vVoaBltSoGU
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[19:42:43] <archivist> a little bit more conveyor may have been more sensible
[19:43:16] <JT-Shop> yea
[19:43:32] <archivist> and enough space to safely walk around
[19:43:45] * JT-Shop can't remember if any hard buttons need to be connected to the GS2 to make it run or not
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[19:48:44] <skunkKandT> btw - some time after the release of mach4 - they are going to have kins support... ;)
[19:48:44] <archivist> for a giggle in some unsafe practices look at some of the nail making machines on youtube
[19:49:47] <JT-Shop> Wafios machines?
[19:50:10] <JT-Shop> or Enkotec or others
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[20:03:35] <archivist> http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=P8it0iw5ysY
[20:06:58] <archivist> http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=_FYXjJEfjAU&feature=related
[20:12:11] <JT-Shop> holy moly that is old Glader technology in the first link and old Wafois technology in the second link
[20:12:35] <JT-Shop> http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=L7JzAUpMtIk
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[20:13:30] <JT-Shop> http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=evV_YdxVTmo
[20:14:04] <JT-Shop> the Enkotecs can run up to 2,000 nails per minute on the smaller machines
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[20:15:09] <JT-Shop> wow they have beefed the Enkotec up and made it more convenient with the swivel door... wonder how long the door hangers last
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[20:15:25] <archivist> there was another indian plant I saw with old technology
[20:15:38] * JT-Shop can't get the GS2 out of stop mode for some reason :/
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[20:20:37] <JT-Shop> I guess 1342 error-count means I don't understand all I need to know to get this up and running
[20:20:51] <Tom_itx> :)
[20:20:58] <Tom_itx> that could be one simple mistake
[20:26:22] <JT-Shop> yea, I've run the other GS2 on the bench, but this one seems to have communication errors I think
[20:27:06] <JT-Shop> hmmm, I might have found it in the docs of all places :0
[20:28:37] <archivist> this is the vid I was trying to find, they are trying to sell machines! http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=D8lgkrJCLE0
[20:29:47] <syyl> thats a god advertise
[20:29:56] <syyl> the machine works even in under worst conditions
[20:30:48] <archivist> hehe
[20:30:59] <syyl> looks a bit like from the begining of the steam-era...
[20:31:33] <syyl> but a bucket of white paint wouldnt hurt...
[20:31:51] <archivist> I wonder how many workers get nailed
[20:32:11] <syyl> i wonder how long it takes to get a new machine THAT dirty :D
[20:35:02] <JT-Shop> not long, drawn wire is nasty with drawing lube all over it
[20:35:20] <archivist> the cad picture did not match the old machines
[20:35:47] <archivist> the final pic had some guarding that none of those had
[20:36:28] <archivist> Im guessing those were old machines and they want to get into manufacture
[20:38:09] <JT-Shop> I've seen some nail plants with one machine on a dirt floor hut and a little old lady running it by her self in Taiwan... you had to walk down a dirt path to get to the hut
[20:38:21] <JT-Shop> so I wonder how they got the machine in there?
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[20:44:31] <elmo40> but they have electricity?
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[20:50:01] <JT-Shop> yep, strung from tree to tree to hut
[20:50:23] * JT-Shop gives up on plug and play GS2 for now
[20:53:50] <skunkKandT> gs2?
[20:53:54] <skunkKandT> vfd?
[20:55:38] <pcw_home> Looks slightly unsafe to collect the nails on the floor
[20:56:42] <syyl> big magnet and a cord?
[20:58:20] <archivist> no stopping machines while you collect the nails
[21:00:58] <Ekkeri> JT-Shop, RS485?
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[22:04:11] <Loetmichel> NOW!... Fits like a glove... Going to bed, its 23:00 over here... -> http://www.cyrom.org/palbum/main.php?g2_itemId=12656 http://www.cyrom.org/palbum/main.php?g2_itemId=12659
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[22:36:44] <Nick001-Shop> is there an easier of getting 2.5 than that buildbot?
[22:37:04] <Nick001-Shop> 11
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