#linuxcnc | Logs for 2012-06-07

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[00:56:21] <r00t4rd3d> nah
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[01:07:23] <Tom_itx> why is 'RUN FROM HERE' greyed out?
[01:07:32] <Tom_itx> what mode do you ned for that to work?
[01:08:16] <Valen> probably out of estop i think
[01:08:33] <Tom_itx> can it be any line?
[01:08:39] <Valen> i dunno
[01:08:46] <Valen> i've only ever done it on G1s
[01:08:47] <Tom_itx> within sensible reason
[01:08:51] <Valen> but i dont see why not?
[01:09:05] <Tom_itx> doesn't estop require re homing?
[01:09:11] <Tom_itx> maybe not
[01:10:51] <Valen> you don't *need* to home for anything
[01:11:11] <Valen> entering and leaving estop is penalty free i believe
[01:11:15] <Tom_itx> ok why didn't the program stop for a tool change?
[01:11:23] <Tom_itx> do i not have a parameter set right for that?
[01:11:26] <Valen> we always go into estop so the servo drives shut down
[01:11:34] <Valen> tool changes are hinky
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[01:11:51] <Valen> have you specified its a manual tool change?
[01:12:06] <Tom_itx> no i haven't done any tool change setup stuff
[01:12:15] <Tom_itx> that's why i'm test cutting air :)
[01:12:21] <Valen> i *think* just the gcode does it for you
[01:12:25] <Tom_itx> no
[01:12:31] <Valen> personally we split the gcode into sections
[01:12:38] <Tom_itx> i'm used to specifying a Tx M6 and that didn't work
[01:12:39] <Valen> i mean there are a number of tool change gcodes
[01:12:51] <Tom_itx> i always use that one
[01:13:17] <atom1> N319 G49 G28 Z0
[01:13:17] <atom1> N320 T2 M06 ( .0625 END MILL )
[01:13:17] <atom1> N321 G17 G00 G90 X-1.5785 Y-1.1843 S2800 M03
[01:13:17] <atom1> N322 G43 Z-0.9 H2
[01:14:04] <Tom_itx> but it didn't stop for the tool change
[01:16:18] <Tom_itx> http://www.linuxcnc.org/docview/html/gui/axis.html#sec:Manual-Tool-Change
[01:16:58] <Tom_itx> looks like i need to add that to my hal file
[01:17:40] <Tom_itx> i suppose most guys that do manual tool change also use touchoff
[01:17:50] <Tom_itx> i preset the tools and put them in the tool table
[01:18:12] <Tom_itx> as per what i'm used to on a 'real' machine environment
[01:19:18] <Tom_itx> so where do i find the sim files?
[01:19:32] <Tom_itx> i didn't copy any preconfigured configs that i know of
[01:23:04] <Valen> manual tool change with touch off is hard for emc i believe
[01:23:15] <Valen> as you cant jog during execution as a rule
[01:23:31] <Tom_itx> i don't need to
[01:23:47] <Tom_itx> it returns to Z zero where i insert another holder
[01:23:51] <Tom_itx> preset
[01:24:19] <Valen> as i said we just split the tools into seperate gcode files
[01:24:26] <Valen> its just easier lol
[01:24:41] <Tom_itx> i'll figure it out
[01:24:48] <Tom_itx> i hope
[01:24:53] <Valen> eventually we want to make a spindle
[01:25:01] <Valen> it will have automatic tool changing
[01:25:55] <Tom_itx> i wish somebody would fix the search page so the google results are at the top instead of after the left side bar
[01:34:04] <r00t4rd3d> the whole website needs professional work.
[01:34:30] <r00t4rd3d> or at least someone who knows what the hell they are doing
[01:37:02] <atom1> i wonder if those nets need to be loaded from a separate hal file
[01:37:21] <atom1> http://www.linuxcnc.org/docview/html/hal/hal-examples.html#_manual_toolchange
[01:37:27] <atom1> i can't tell
[01:37:40] <atom1> i copied those lines in and get errors
[01:42:00] <atom1> ok i must have had some other tool change lines defined
[01:42:09] <atom1> now to give it a try
[01:51:10] <Tom_itx> that did the trick
[01:54:36] <Tom_itx> it pops up a dialog box with a button to continue
[01:54:50] <Tom_itx> as advertised
[01:55:11] <Tom_itx> Valen, you should try it
[01:55:26] <Tom_itx> unless you have to change collets and can't
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[01:58:29] <Valen> we have collets so need to re-zero anyway
[01:58:43] <Tom_itx> wouldn't help you then
[01:58:52] <Tom_itx> unless you switch to tool holders
[02:08:11] <atom1> mmm, it doesn't like my G49 at the end of the file
[02:10:48] <atom1> i better fix that in the post template
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[02:56:16] <uw> hello question about half stepping and full stepping for steppers. The motor driver has two pins that when driven low are high can associate STEP pulses as quarter, half or full, depending on the input
[02:57:06] <uw> say 0-0 = full step , 0-1 = half step , 1-0 = quarter step, 1-1 = no step
[02:57:58] <uw> I have them assigned as "I/O output" on the step config wizard, pins 14 and 16 of my parallel port
[02:58:38] <uw> So, my question is how can i drive them low to enable table movement?
[02:58:58] <uw> as it stands now they are floating (1-1) so the table doesnt move
[02:59:30] <jdhNC> you can put pulldowns on them
[02:59:42] <uw> i would normally just physically tie them to ground with wire and that worked, but I am looking for a software solution if possible
[02:59:51] <Valen> why?
[03:00:07] <Valen> why not just tie them to quater step?
[03:00:14] <jdhNC> do you have some need to switch stepmodes on the fly? Why not just hardwire them to what you want.
[03:00:15] <Valen> use the i/os for something else?
[03:00:54] <uw> jdhNC, Valen ok so i guess this is a "best practice" question here as well, as im pretty new to this
[03:01:11] <uw> Typically, does linuxcnc change the step mode?
[03:01:12] <jdhNC> what drives are they?
[03:01:13] <uw> or can it?
[03:01:22] <Valen> *generally* people report smoother movements at higher levels of microstepping
[03:01:45] <jdhNC> it can set IO lines. Never heard of anyone switching stepmodes that way though.
[03:01:48] <Valen> it would be possible, to have different configs for different step rates
[03:01:56] <Valen> but you couldn't change it on the fly
[03:02:06] <Valen> well at least i dont think you could
[03:02:10] <jdhNC> you could, your scale would just be off :)
[03:02:17] <Valen> (well you could change it, but i dont think emc could handle it)
[03:02:26] <Valen> thats what i was trying to say
[03:02:54] <uw> ok so i guess theres no really need to switch to course mode (full step)?
[03:03:01] <jdhNC> no.
[03:03:08] <Valen> unless your running into issues with step rate (ie physically getting enough pulses out of the computer) I'd just tie to to the finest mode your driver can handle
[03:03:15] <jdhNC> if you need full step mode for torque, you need to leave it there.
[03:03:17] <uw> ok thanks (sorry, super noob here lol)
[03:03:39] <Valen> quater step would still have the same torque when you get to the poles though jdhNC?
[03:03:42] <jdhNC> if you change from say full to half, your distance travelled would also drop in half
[03:04:04] <uw> the driver btw is called "opti step" from microkenitcs (cant find any info on it)
[03:04:22] <Valen> I'm after a teensy stepper driver, the more micro steps the better
[03:04:28] <jdhNC> Valen: there is a nice paper somewhere on torque vs. uStep modes
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[03:04:58] <jdhNC> http://www.microkinetics.com/pdfmanuals/OptiStep.pdf
[03:05:05] <jdhNC> that?
[03:07:36] <Valen> i can see the torque would follow a sine curve when microstepping
[03:07:39] <uw> well, that is the similar (but pin incompatible) successor of the unit. it is called "opti driver" and is in a paxton patterson CNC training mill. was made in 1994
[03:08:14] <uw> i was able to get 2 pages off archive.org for the thing, as they have since yanked it from the website
[03:09:09] <jdhNC> http://www.micromo.com/microstepping-myths-and-realities.aspx
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[03:10:05] <Valen> yeah the incremental torque to use their nomenclature
[03:10:25] <Valen> but when you hit the poles it is still full torque
[03:12:19] <Valen> the advantage to microstepping isn't so much the increased resolution, its smoother operation and fewer harmonics
[03:12:54] <Valen> rather than "hitting" it every time it steps it will smoothly push from one to the next, so your less likley to excite a resonance
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[03:13:15] <uw> ok so i will just adapt my cable and leave it as always microstepping. btw this is what ive had before and it did work fine. I just wasnt sure if it would be more efficient (faster) if linuxcnc would control the step rate
[03:13:55] <Valen> what is limiting your speed?
[03:14:45] <Jymmm> physics
[03:14:45] <uw> I am guessing torque of the motor but really i havent used it much yet to say for sure
[03:15:15] <uw> i was thinking that maybe full stepping would make it faster for some reason
[03:15:17] <Valen> *generally* available voltage sets your top speed
[03:15:22] <uw> looking back, that doesnt make much sense
[03:15:32] <Valen> well it is a common result
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[03:15:50] <uw> hmm
[03:15:56] <Valen> microstepping makes things smoother so its less likley to loose a step when your going faster
[03:16:23] <uw> the unit has a fixed 5v supply and i havent tried messing with it yet. Im not sure the opti driver supports much higher (cant find documentation on it)
[03:16:50] <Valen> 5v? is it for writing on dvd's with a texta or something lol
[03:17:03] <Valen> 5v for logic sure
[03:17:39] <Valen> but steppers are usually 12v at least? (i could be wrong but i am pretty sure the low end geckos drop out at 11 and a bit)
[03:18:59] <uw> ok just went and checked it out
[03:19:15] <uw> the motors say 6V
[03:19:19] <Tom_itx> ok got the first good part off using linuxcnc
[03:19:42] <Valen> that will be the voltage you put through them for holding
[03:19:50] <uw> howeer the power supply also made by microkinetics says 36V
[03:19:51] <Tom_itx> post is fixed i think, figured out the tool change in hal, set all the tools in the tool table
[03:19:52] <Valen> IE if you feed them 6v you can't break them ;->
[03:19:57] <Valen> yes thats more like it
[03:20:25] <uw> ok also it is a sherline CNC mini mill
[03:20:40] <uw> packaged in some bootleg training center, which houses the opti stepper
[03:20:45] <Tom_itx> the 203v needs 18 to 80v
[03:21:02] <Tom_itx> uw, so is mine
[03:21:17] <uw> lol is the case red?
[03:21:30] <Tom_itx> just finished updating the psu steppers and drivers
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[03:21:47] <Tom_itx> oh and switched to linuxcnc
[03:21:57] <Tom_itx> from my old control software
[03:25:33] <Tom_itx> http://tom-itx.dyndns.org:81/~webpage/boards/USBTiny_Mkii/Boxes/milling1.jpg
[03:25:37] <Tom_itx> there's mine
[03:25:53] <uw> btw Valen jdhNC thank you for your help
[03:25:59] <Valen> nw
[03:26:07] <Tom_itx> looks a bit different now that it's rewired with larger steppers
[03:26:22] <Valen> awww its cute Tom_itx ;-P
[03:26:31] <Tom_itx> it works
[03:26:48] <Tom_itx> i'd rather have a full size one in a nice air conditioned shop
[03:26:50] <Valen> i'm just raggin on yer
[03:26:53] <Tom_itx> i know
[03:27:04] <Tom_itx> the process is still the same
[03:27:06] <Valen> direct drive on the steppers hrm
[03:27:16] <Tom_itx> they do ok
[03:27:30] <Tom_itx> i get about 80 ipm which is more than it can feed while cutting
[03:27:31] <Valen> i would have thaought belt reduction for more acceleration
[03:27:48] <Valen> acceleration seems to be the real figure of merit these days
[03:27:58] <Valen> at least for me
[03:28:04] <Tom_itx> i was getting about 20 to 25 max before
[03:28:14] <Tom_itx> so i'm happy with the upgrades
[03:28:14] <Valen> that might have been a bit low
[03:28:27] <Valen> what size are the ones in the pics 17?
[03:29:55] <Tom_itx> 23
[03:30:02] <Tom_itx> i went with 23 doublestack
[03:30:03] <Valen> you went bigger than 23?
[03:30:05] <Valen> wow
[03:30:23] <Valen> seems like overkill somehow
[03:30:31] <Tom_itx> why?
[03:30:50] <Valen> i *think* i see people driving bridgeports with 23s
[03:30:59] <Tom_itx> i don't think so
[03:31:17] <Tom_itx> http://www.kelinginc.net/NEMA23Motor.html
[03:31:21] <Tom_itx> #3 there
[03:31:24] <Tom_itx> is the one i have
[03:31:33] <Tom_itx> 282 oz in
[03:31:55] <Tom_itx> bp would take 400 to 500 i would think
[03:31:58] <Tom_itx> maybe more
[03:32:13] <Tom_itx> these aren't ballscrews either
[03:32:32] <Valen> they normally run a 4:1 reduction
[03:32:35] <Valen> and perhaps more volts
[03:32:41] <Valen> and ballscrews
[03:32:57] <Tom_itx> i'm at 50v now
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[03:33:08] <Tom_itx> was 25 or thereabouts
[03:33:13] <Valen> you actually using the 50v?
[03:33:27] <Tom_itx> it's wired to the stepper drivers
[03:33:45] <Valen> i meant how much voltage is the driver giving to the motors during a rapid
[03:33:55] <Tom_itx> i dunno how to tell
[03:34:02] <Valen> scope it
[03:34:02] <Tom_itx> it's current limited to 3.5A
[03:34:22] <Tom_itx> the steppers are rated for 4.2
[03:34:43] <Valen> the psu is limited or the driver?
[03:34:48] <Tom_itx> the driver
[03:34:59] <Tom_itx> current limit resistors on each one
[03:35:30] <Tom_itx> they don't run hot, just warm to the touch
[03:35:34] <Tom_itx> the steppers get warmer
[03:35:44] <Tom_itx> but not any warmer than they used to
[03:35:55] <Valen> they shouldn't really
[03:36:09] <Valen> current limit resistor is probably a sense resistor
[03:36:13] <Valen> .0something ohms
[03:36:21] <Valen> (well hopefully lol)
[03:36:24] <Tom_itx> it's user selectable
[03:36:31] <Tom_itx> i put a 47k on it
[03:36:33] <Tom_itx> iirc
[03:36:49] <Valen> yeah, that'll be some kind of amplifier then
[03:37:08] <Tom_itx> it's quite a driver i think
[03:37:25] <Valen> http://finance.groups.yahoo.com/group/geckodrive/message/21085
[03:37:26] <Tom_itx> 1 sec after the last pulse is received it drops the current by 71%
[03:37:46] <Valen> using nema 23 steppers on a bp
[03:38:37] <Tom_itx> there are lots of different nema23 steppers though
[03:38:42] <Valen> true that
[03:39:02] <Tom_itx> some as high as 570 in oz
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[03:39:06] <Valen> I'm trying to work out if i should go steppers or servos for our new mills
[03:39:08] <Tom_itx> look on the kelinginc page
[03:39:11] <Valen> we like servos
[03:39:19] <Valen> but they are spendy :-<
[03:39:22] <Tom_itx> i would to but these are cheaper
[03:39:34] <Tom_itx> and especially for this little mill
[03:39:50] <Tom_itx> i think it's working about as good as it can now
[03:40:04] <Tom_itx> beyond a mill upgrade
[03:40:12] <Valen> if it does what your after then its all good
[03:40:24] <Tom_itx> i'm always after more
[03:40:35] <Valen> our new mill is going to be 5 axis of stainless steel coated epoxy granite filled goodness ;->
[03:40:46] <Tom_itx> it's why i went with the drivers i did, so i can use them if i do upgrade
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[03:46:31] <Tom_itx> now to find a proper enclosure for all the electronics
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[03:57:41] <Jymmm> dumpster?
[03:59:46] <Jymmm> portable and room for expantion
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[04:30:18] <uw> hey Tom_itx
[04:30:33] <uw> do you happen to have a config file for your sherline?
[04:30:56] <uw> that you wouldnt mind sharing?
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[06:10:23] <uw> hi again
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[07:03:28] <DJ9DJ> moin
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[07:15:21] <jd896_fabshop> morning people
[07:16:31] <jd896_fabshop> does anybody have any views on inverse deadband? if found that my old anologe amps dont respond til around 0.15volt will this sort it
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[07:25:35] <archivist> jd896_fabshop, didnt you say your amps are velocity mode? as that comp mentions torque mode
[07:25:47] <archivist> you need to ask awallin
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[08:03:57] <jd896_fabshop> yeah in does say that but my drive dont respond the are velocity i've spoken to the esab engineer i know and he wasn't surprised buy this, maybe they do it for noise immunity?
[08:06:10] <archivist> could try it
[08:06:52] <Valen> i'd be concerned about it oscilating
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[08:17:41] <jd896_fabshop> butim getting spikes the my following error that i cannot get out i think its down to the drives not responding due to the low dac output
[08:18:16] <Valen> looked at it with halscope?
[08:22:08] <jd896_fabshop> yeah
[08:23:05] <jd896_fabshop> untill output reaches above 0.15 i get no velocity
[08:26:12] <Valen> i meant your ferror
[08:42:53] <jd896_fabshop> yeah
[08:43:01] <jd896_fabshop> that too
[08:46:32] <jd896_fabshop> theres a scope shot on the forum esab ultrarex
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[09:23:36] <jd896_fabshop> is big john aruond
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[10:49:46] <jthornton> 4:25 is way too early for him
[10:50:10] <jthornton> and he over slept this morning too
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[11:52:29] <Tom_itx> jthornton, what about 6:52?
[11:52:50] <Tom_itx> sleep much more and the day will be over
[11:53:31] <archivist> probably got woken by the dog whining about breakfast
[11:53:49] <jthornton> I'm usually up at 5:01
[11:53:51] <Tom_itx> cut my first parts off using linuxcnc last night after fixing the manual tool change code
[11:54:00] <jthornton> nice
[11:54:02] <Tom_itx> thanks to you and others here
[11:55:14] <Tom_itx> finally got my cam post tweaked the way i want it and figured out what the tool table expects for tool offset entries etc
[11:55:45] <Tom_itx> apparently most here who use manual tool change use touch off
[11:57:49] <jthornton> I'm sure I don't understand the last statement
[11:58:41] <Tom_itx> setting one tool at a time during machining instead of setting them all at once and entering them in the tool length offset in the tool table
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[11:59:00] <Tom_itx> with some sort of touch off device
[12:00:00] <Tom_itx> unless of course they have a tool changer
[12:01:19] <jthornton> the problem is if you don't have some magic Z touch off switch that you probe to after the tool change it doesn't make sense to even use the tool table if your spindle is a collet one
[12:03:21] <Tom_itx> i think that's been brought up here
[12:06:20] <Tom_itx> for example being able to change a tool if it breaks or gets dull then continuing where you left off
[12:07:32] <jthornton> yea, there has been a lot of discussion on that subject
[12:07:58] <Tom_itx> it's one thing i see lacking over conventional cnc's
[12:09:49] <archivist> conventional users can afford a stack of pre set tools in holders
[12:10:00] <Tom_itx> yup
[12:10:41] <Tom_itx> those are not typically your hobyist machines
[12:10:44] <archivist> and some tools defy easy touch off
[12:11:27] <Tom_itx> yeah, i've had some cutters i wasn't really sure how to code for in my cad cam too
[12:11:45] <Tom_itx> at least to make the model look right
[12:11:53] <jthornton> what kind of cutters?
[12:11:58] <Tom_itx> tapered cutters
[12:12:03] <archivist> gear cutters
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[12:12:58] <Tom_itx> or radius cutters
[12:13:10] <Tom_itx> is another one that makes you stop and go hmmmm
[12:13:47] <jthornton> you mean like convex radius end mills?
[12:13:58] <Tom_itx> not ball nose
[12:14:28] <Tom_itx> for outter corner radius
[12:14:58] <Tom_itx> on some parts we would let the cnc help us debur
[12:15:02] <jthornton> yea, you gotta know the tip diameter of them
[12:15:49] <archivist> on a gear cutter you want the centre line and pcd
[12:15:58] <Tom_itx> it's one of those things that just doent look right in the cad model
[12:17:12] <Tom_itx> then you go back 6mo later and look at it and wonder wtf that tool path is for
[12:18:38] <jthornton> lol
[12:19:14] <jthornton> I usually just create new tool paths unless it is a part that I do often and I've not found one of them yet
[12:19:24] <Tom_itx> sometimes you just hope the operator is smart enough to make adjustments at the machine
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[12:20:30] <Tom_itx> when we did work for experimental it was like that. just make sets of 6 of every part and you may never see it again
[12:21:35] <archivist> mass production! /me usually making one offs
[12:21:58] <jthornton> I have one thing that I make that is up to 10 sets now! the rest are usually 1
[12:22:34] <Tom_itx> the gravy is when you can just shove the file out to the machine and turn it over to the operator
[12:23:26] <Tom_itx> in which JT-Shop's case he would just change hats and take a few steps
[12:24:34] <jthornton> I gave up on the hats a long time ago and just do everything myself with the one hat on
[12:24:47] <Tom_itx> heh
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[13:36:51] <jdhNC> I need a X limit switch mount/cover for my G0704. Anyone have anything similar to save me the inspiration & design time?
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[13:40:47] <archivist> I never had the inspiration for switches never mind covers for them
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[13:53:38] <jdhNC> you never accidentaly hit hard end-of-travel things?
[14:11:12] <mrsun> hmm, when the material sparks sometimes, is it safe to assume the material is hardened? ... i find it very tough to run in the lathe :/
[14:11:20] <archivist> no, I use the hard end to set the machine home, then the software limits keep work inside usable limits
[14:11:24] <mrsun> (its from an axle .. dont know if they are hardened or not .. 60mm diameter)
[14:13:37] <archivist> carbide tool or blunt tool
[14:13:57] <mrsun> im trying to get to use the carbide tooling ... making new T nut :P
[14:14:25] <mrsun> got some small carbide cutters, they cut it .. but hss newly ground tool can take a cut like 5mm then it just wont cut anymore =)
[14:14:27] <jdhNC> so every startup, you manuall jog to one end and home?
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[14:21:04] <archivist> jdhNC, yes (ran out of parport pins for switches really)
[14:22:19] <jdhNC> I have plenty of mesa pins to waste. I'd do them all separate if it wasn't such a pain to wire.
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[15:17:05] <JT-Shop> jd896_fabshop: you still need my help?
[15:19:53] <archivist> any one need a big mill? https://www.apexauctions.co.uk/auction/itemDetails.htm?lotId=74159&utm_source=ActOn&utm_medium=Email&utm_campaign=Eaves
[15:25:18] <JT-Shop> can you email it to me?
[15:27:21] <jdhNC> I need a manual one that size.
[15:27:36] <archivist> I would email it to me first :)
[15:29:45] <archivist> JT-Shop, do you have the space to make a shed for it?
[15:30:07] <JT-Shop> I'm sure I do with 9 acres
[15:37:40] <jdhNC> you're going to need a bigger phase converter
[15:38:53] <JT-Shop> LOL
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[15:54:18] <Jymmm> First thing you gotta mill is a new car just so you can say you did
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[15:55:48] <Jymmm> And it has PANDUIT! lol
[15:56:09] <jdhNC> I bought panduit, and got some panduit with my enclosure... but had no room for it.
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[16:13:01] <Connor> jdhNC: Got those covers boxed up.. I'll try to get them sent out today.
[16:13:12] <Connor> Gotta have the wife print the label and postage.
[16:13:45] <jdhNC> thanks!
[16:14:13] <jdhNC> I can paypal postage/materials/etc.
[16:14:27] <Connor> materials isn't a biggie.
[16:14:43] <Connor> Not sure about postage yet.
[16:15:44] <jdhNC> how did you attach your front estop box?
[16:16:27] <Connor> I clamped it to the main box and drilled two holes.. and then tapped them.
[16:16:58] <jdhNC> I was hoping to avoid drilling, but I don't think anything else will hold it securely enough.
[16:17:10] <Connor> drilling the pass-through hole was fun.. I just drilled a spot hole on both parts and drilled them bigger separately.
[16:17:35] <Connor> No real way around it.
[16:18:03] <jdhNC> pass-through what?
[16:18:10] <Connor> When I make my full enclosure, it, along with the main control box will move.
[16:18:58] <Connor> I'm using a DB9 cable up to main e-Stop box. I have a break-out inside to pass pwm into it.. and I need to bring the 120v line down into it for the AC relay.
[16:19:46] <Connor> pwm/5v/gnd/ccw relay + 120v from the chip guard switch.
[16:20:05] <Connor> Oh. and the spindle encoders too.
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[16:21:09] <jdhNC> I have an separate SSR mounted in the enclosure for spindle A/C but I haven't hooked it up yet. I'm just going to power an outlet via the SSR.
[16:23:46] <Connor> Ah, okay. Yea, I used a Radio Shack Relay inside the e-Stop box for it.
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[16:24:16] <Connor> running the +12v line up from the secondary charge pump relay.
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[16:25:56] <jdhNC> I had scavenged a nice sub-panel with terminal strip, SSR and 4PDT relay. Used those for the estop circuit and added another SSR for spindle. It will be energized via an output pin through one of the 4p relay contacts
[16:26:04] <Connor> When/If I decide to do spindle CCW relay.. I'll have a 12v source I can run into the contact on the C43 board to trip it.
[16:26:56] <jdhNC> I'm not sure I care about reversing anymore. A tap head seems like it would be better/safer for tapping and I can't think of any other use.
[16:27:15] <Connor> probably true.
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[16:55:24] <jdhNC> connor: do you have a Z switch mounted?
[16:55:33] <Connor> No. Just the X right now.
[16:55:43] <jdhNC> got pics of X?
[16:56:25] <jdhNC> it looks like the obvious places for a Z flag would be on top of the gibs
[16:57:37] <Connor> http://www.cnczone.com/forums/attachment.php?attachmentid=160579&amp;d=1338155034
[16:57:45] <Connor> http://www.cnczone.com/forums/attachment.php?attachmentid=160580&amp;d=1338155042
[16:58:13] <Connor> I need to cover it, because chips can land on top of it.. and cause a pre-mature endstop event. Had it happen already.
[16:59:22] <jdhNC> I saw a pic somewhere that someone had milled out a pocket for the switch and mounted it open-side to the mill for a combo cover/holder
[17:00:04] <jdhNC> my prox switches are too tall (or wrong orientation) to fit on X.
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[17:00:34] <Connor> http://www.g0704.com/Projects.html
[17:00:46] <Connor> look for Home and LImit switches on Hoss page.. that's what I want to do for the Z.
[17:01:45] <Connor> I don't like how he's done the Y though.
[17:02:08] <jdhNC> http://www.cnczone.com/forums/attachment.php?attachmentid=153054&d=1329557652
[17:02:22] <IchGuckLive> Connor: as you know evervone makes its own build
[17:02:51] <Connor> IchGuckLive: Yup. :) To each his own as we say.
[17:03:32] <IchGuckLive> what RPM you want at the spindle
[17:03:32] <jdhNC> I think I will have to take the X back off to mount anything
[17:03:57] <Connor> IchGuckLive: ? For the 4th Axis ?
[17:04:15] <IchGuckLive> you can go flex with a blet 1inch wide over 2 cones
[17:04:56] <IchGuckLive> Belt !
[17:05:53] <Connor> probably somewhere between 2500-3000 RPM on the 4th Axis spindle. Probably 2 modes, one for indexing (low gear) and one for turning high gear
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[17:06:32] <IchGuckLive> as on a real lathe
[17:06:37] <Connor> yea.
[17:06:54] <Connor> I'll probably use a 4 or 5" Chuck on it.
[17:07:07] <IchGuckLive> good to go
[17:07:56] <Connor> I have a 4" on a R8 that, once I get 4axis built.. I'll remove the R8 arbor from it.. and use it on 4th axis
[17:09:19] <IchGuckLive> so 1HP is a litel low with the MY1020
[17:10:05] <Connor> From my understanding.. Rotary carving isn't hard to do.. You just use the 4th axis as if it's the Y axis.. center the Y axis up correctly and your good to go.
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[17:10:57] <IchGuckLive> agree on that
[17:11:15] <IchGuckLive> also the motor is goot to handle by the electronics
[17:11:54] <IchGuckLive> do you got a mesa atattched ?
[17:11:55] <Connor> I only have a 48v PSU.
[17:12:04] <Connor> No. Just ParPorts ATM
[17:13:06] <IchGuckLive> Heavy Thunder hedding my way its gettig dark outside by the seconds
[17:13:22] <Connor> That's not good.
[17:13:44] <IchGuckLive> if i feel the first lightning i will close down
[17:13:53] <Connor> Heard that.
[17:14:14] <IchGuckLive> http://www.wetter.com/wetter_aktuell/niederschlagsradar/deutschland/ RADAR
[17:14:35] <Connor> Wowsers.
[17:15:08] <Connor> Hmm.. 36v with 48v PSU..
[17:15:23] <Connor> http://www.automationtechnologiesinc.com/products-page/nema23-m-dc-servo-motor/skewed-servo-dual-shaft-3
[17:15:46] <IchGuckLive> i woudent go with only one PSU at the spindle and all the axis that will force trouble
[17:16:36] <Connor> http://www.ivdc.com/cnc/conversion/enclosure.JPG
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[17:16:59] <Connor> I've got room for another PSU in top right if I remove the usless CDROM
[17:17:27] <IchGuckLive> nice price and the driver from Gecko ?
[17:17:54] <IchGuckLive> The speed is good if you go for Direct
[17:18:04] <Connor> http://www.automationtechnologiesinc.com/products-page/dc-servo-motor-driver
[17:18:10] <IchGuckLive> with a 1000Encoder its perfect
[17:18:23] <Connor> Either the G32-X or that Dugong
[17:18:29] <Connor> G320X
[17:18:37] <IchGuckLive> as i said yesterday
[17:18:37] <jdhNC> the gecko only does step/dir?
[17:18:47] <IchGuckLive> yes step dir
[17:19:36] <Connor> So, it handles the encoders directyly.
[17:20:02] <IchGuckLive> does automotion sell on ebay via paypal or amazon
[17:20:11] <jdhNC> so you have to have a stepgen for speed?
[17:20:25] <Connor> IchGuckLive: They take paypal direct from the site.
[17:20:32] <jdhNC> Ich: they are keling's new name
[17:20:55] <Connor> jdhNC: I think so, you treat it just like a stepper at that point??
[17:22:13] <Connor> 42 oz-in constant torque good enough for 1:1 drive ?
[17:22:46] <IchGuckLive> leadscrew pitch ?
[17:23:00] <Connor> this for spindle drive
[17:23:12] <Connor> driving that 4" chuck.
[17:23:18] <IchGuckLive> no way
[17:23:58] <Connor> Rated at 230 oz-in peak torque / 42 oz-in constant torque
[17:26:54] <IchGuckLive> Blue sky ahad here no lightning at all
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[17:27:59] <Connor> 4th axis is going to have to wait a while.
[17:28:38] <Connor> maybe I just use stepper on my rotary table and use the mini lathe for turning.
[17:29:58] <Jymmm> For the record... JB-Weld *DOES* contain iron particles. But they are saying as it cures, the polymer "encapsulates" these particles. That is still yet to be determined as still curing.
[17:30:29] <Connor> Jymmm: You STILL going on about that? :)
[17:30:55] <Jymmm> Connor: I just got off the phone with the General Manager of JB-Weld.
[17:31:37] <TekniQue> nice
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[17:42:14] <Tom_itx> Jymmm did he send you some free samples?
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[17:43:12] <Jymmm> Tom_itx: Not yet, but might after the product cures and I let him know the results.
[17:44:55] <TekniQue> what are you fixing?
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[17:45:09] <TekniQue> I think jb weld is too runny
[17:45:10] <TekniQue> too liquid
[17:45:18] <TekniQue> great product otherwise
[17:45:20] <Jymmm> hardly
[17:45:53] <Jymmm> it's as thick as axel grease, at least for me.
[17:46:01] <TekniQue> I've had problems with it running away before it cures
[17:46:08] <syyl> tried warming it up?
[17:46:12] <TekniQue> nope
[17:46:17] <syyl> then it should get liquid like water :D
[17:47:20] <TekniQue> if I wait 10 minutes after mixing it, then it's easier to make it maintain its shape
[17:48:01] <TekniQue> jb weld also cures the slowest of all these steel epoxies I've been using
[17:48:26] <Jymmm> TekniQue: it's not crazy glue
[17:48:27] <TekniQue> some of them will be rock hard in 10 minutes
[17:48:47] <andypugh> The 2-part eppoxy putties can be very useful.
[17:48:57] <syyl> many of the "slow" epoxies can be cured faster using heat
[17:49:14] <Jymmm> andypugh: I haven't seen those on the shelf anymore, I even looked for them the other day.
[17:49:15] <syyl> or slowed down with the fridge
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[17:49:48] <Jymmm> andypugh: I'l ask the GM when I speak to him next.
[17:51:56] <andypugh> Jymmm: http://www.uktoolcentre.co.uk/Shop/p~40752~Plumber~Fix-Leak-Fixer-Single-64g.html?utm_campaign=googleshopping&utm_source=GoogleBase&utm_medium=Product+Search&gclid=CO7PosDYvLACFUdlfAodhEz_pw
[17:52:12] <andypugh> (I have no way to do a US-specific search, so you will have to find it yourself)
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[18:26:45] <alex4nder> hey
[18:27:38] <Jymmm> andypugh: it's all good. JB-Weld *USED* to have the putty, just not sure if this store didn't stock it, or it's no longer made is all.
[18:27:45] <andypugh> http://www.ppauctions.com/eshots/20120621/
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[18:29:31] <Jymmm> andypugh: archivist found this for you https://www.apexauctions.co.uk/auction/itemDetails.htm?lotId=74159&utm_source=ActOn&utm_medium=Email&utm_campaign=Eaves
[18:30:30] <archivist> I found it for me but lack of space and money stops me from playing!
[18:30:40] <andypugh> It a bit small for my needs.
[18:30:54] <archivist> lies
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[19:30:29] <andypugh> Currently designing a Hexapod camera "tripod" for a friend. He wants a star-tracker.
[19:30:58] <andypugh> I know it is trivial to achieve with 2 bits of wood, a hinge and one stepper, but that's no fun.
[19:31:52] <Jymmm> andypugh: replace the hinge with duct tape, and the sticks with EPS =)
[19:32:48] <Jymmm> andypugh: or hell, make it ALL out of duct tape, there's a challenge for ya
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[19:40:27] <mhaberler> like so? http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=b61f6bAuytw
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[20:00:47] <andypugh> 1294381 days 20 hours remaining - 7.90 GB of 7.03 GB. Something wrong there
[20:03:53] <micges> andypugh: windows?
[20:04:14] <andypugh> Yes. Autodesk Inventor download, in fact.
[20:05:25] <micges> heh
[20:05:53] <andypugh> This is the Autodesk Download Wizard thingy that is messing up downloading its own file.
[20:12:11] <Jymmm> mhaberler: Ya know... That would be kinda interesting to do.
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[20:12:56] <mhaberler> he's 'Duct Tape Ambassador' for 3M
[20:19:10] <Jymmm> really?
[20:19:39] <Jymmm> It make perfect sense marketing wise.
[20:20:10] <Jymmm> But I mean the whole head-to-head car thing.
[20:21:24] <Jymmm> hydraulic steering would deal with the inverse thing.
[20:22:22] <Jymmm> just have to deal with the in drive / neutral thing transmission wise.
[20:24:10] <Jymmm> and the gas tank right behind the driver thing too =)
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[20:53:43] <DJ9DJ> gn8
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[21:14:42] <jd896> Evening all
[21:15:01] <JT-Shop> evening
[21:15:13] <JT-Shop> rather late for you I suppose
[21:15:24] <jd896> 10:15 here
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[21:16:32] <JT-Shop> you get your MDI commands to working?
[21:17:36] <jd896> I did not John could you point me to some useful manuals
[21:17:48] <jd896> As.
[21:18:43] <JT-Shop> it just takes a few things, do you have your pyvcp button working?
[21:19:50] <jd896> Yeah the botton is there but where are the pin links
[21:20:39] <JT-Shop> do you have the MDI command in your ini file in the HALUI section?
[21:21:03] <jd896> Yes I have done that
[21:21:11] <andypugh> Hmm, 2220 here too. I ought to make my dinner.
[21:22:07] <jd896> Come to think of it I tried to add two command buttons that maybe where I've gone wrong
[21:22:14] <JT-Shop> open up the show hal configuration window and look for the names of your pyvcp pin and the mdi pin
[21:22:31] <JT-Shop> you can have more than one
[21:22:34] <jd896> Anypugh are you uk based
[21:23:12] <jd896> Ah im at home now left my laptop at the shop next to the profiler
[21:23:28] <jd896> Carnt get to a pc ATM
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[21:23:53] <JT-Shop> the pin reference http://linuxcnc.org/docview/html/gui/halui.html
[21:24:19] <JT-Shop> read the MDI section it should be clear
[21:25:09] <andypugh> who was looking at Tormachs a while ago?
[21:25:15] <JT-Shop> so a net my-mdi halui.mdi-command-00 <= pyvcp.mybuttonname
[21:25:25] <andypugh> logger[psha]:
[21:25:50] <jd896> That's where I've gone wrong with the numbering
[21:25:57] <JT-Shop> I think andypugh missed your question while cooking his bubbles and squeak
[21:26:14] <JT-Shop> the manual clear it up for you?
[21:26:57] <jd896> Yes mate spot on its just nowing where too look
[21:27:22] <andypugh> jd896: Yes, I am her Brittanic Majesty's United Kingdom. Basildon, in fact.
[21:27:36] <JT-Shop> :)
[21:28:00] <andypugh> Gigs-: Were you looking at Tormach?
[21:28:21] <jd896> Ah Got a spanner monkey friend down there
[21:29:07] <jd896> Basildon I mean
[21:29:09] <andypugh> How terribly working class!
[21:29:39] <jd896> Pah my previous job title that
[21:30:12] <jd896> That and "Hgv technician"
[21:30:42] <andypugh> "Lorry Wrangler"?
[21:31:02] <andypugh> Up to 13.5GB of my 7.3 GB now
[21:31:06] <jd896> Yeah
[21:31:48] <jd896> Really enjoyed it as it goes
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[21:38:43] <frallzor> its odd how one operations works like a charm one day
[21:38:46] <frallzor> * -s
[21:38:57] <frallzor> then the same type the next day = crap
[21:39:44] <jd896> Can I set a feed rate be set till further notice in a sub routine ?
[21:40:23] <jd896> #and it stay set after the sub has finished
[21:40:46] <Gigs-> andypugh: yes
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[21:43:36] <jd896> Sorry got disconnected there poor iPhone lime chat
[21:47:37] <jd896> Did any one reply is it possible?
[21:49:06] <Gigs-> no one answered
[21:50:21] <jd896> Bugger
[21:50:40] <JT-Shop> jd896: yes, use global or named
[21:50:58] <JT-Shop> http://linuxcnc.org/docview/html/gcode/overview.html#_parameters_variables_a_id_sec_parameters_a
[21:51:04] <frallzor> I hate tools sometimes =(
[21:52:13] <JT-Shop> I hate when I can'
[21:52:17] <JT-Shop> t find a tool
[21:52:44] <frallzor> yesterday my alu-cutter was doing terrific
[21:52:52] <frallzor> today, all hell broke loose
[21:52:56] <frallzor> and the tool aswell =)
[21:54:47] <jd896> Would that be a named vale stays in the sub and a global stays after the sub
[21:55:39] <jd896> Could I get the feed from say a pyvcp box?
[21:57:37] <JT-Shop> afaik the only local variables in a subroutine are 1-30
[21:58:02] <JT-Shop> like a spin box to set the F numer?
[21:58:12] <jd896> Yeah
[21:58:17] <JT-Shop> hmmm
[21:58:28] <andypugh> Gigs-: Have you seen the Smithy machines?
[21:58:38] <jd896> Sounds like a nice touch
[21:58:45] <andypugh> A complete LinuxCNC / Mesa setup all ready to go,
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[22:01:16] <JT-Shop> jd896: I can't think of a way to do that off the top of my head
[22:02:12] <frallzor> even though one fails its fun to see what things could have been =) http://www.lolz.se/uploader/pics/test%20fotos.jpg allmost a chassis
[22:02:17] <andypugh> frallzor: That was the one-flute?
[22:02:22] <JT-Shop> you wanting to change the F while a program runs?
[22:02:33] <frallzor> andypugh indeed
[22:02:46] <frallzor> worked like a charm yesterday, not a single sign of wear and tear
[22:03:09] <frallzor> but like 2nd cut today, like 40mm cuts, smearing alu
[22:03:40] <andypugh> I guess it needs a clean?
[22:03:50] <frallzor> nah it was clean, checked before use
[22:03:59] <frallzor> since it was first time yesterday i used it
[22:04:07] <jd896> No just to set at start of cut then in the end cut sub change back to rapid
[22:04:11] <andypugh> Spindle running the right direction?
[22:04:19] <frallzor> yup, same like yesterday
[22:04:27] <frallzor> no changed at all
[22:04:29] <frallzor> *S
[22:04:46] <frallzor> except bad piece and tool is now in tool-heaven
[22:05:31] <JT-Shop> jd896: you can pass the F info to your sub when you call it
[22:05:38] <frallzor> but I noticed some lifting of the sheet i was machining, I assume it was that that casued it
[22:06:21] <jd896> So how would we do that
[22:06:49] <jd896> With the box ?
[22:08:55] <andypugh> O100 CALL <sub> [1000]
[22:10:40] <jd896> That would be in the gcode wouldn't it Andy
[22:11:51] <andypugh> Yes. Sorry, I misunderstood the question
[22:12:08] <jd896> No worries
[22:14:45] <Tom_itx> JT-Shop what other useful MDI commands have you 'buttonized'?
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[22:16:56] <JT-Shop> touch off
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[22:17:14] <Tom_itx> what are you using as a touch pad?
[22:17:23] <jd896> Jt looking at your touch off sub don't you pull values front some ware outside the sub
[22:17:24] <JT-Shop> 0.375" dowel
[22:17:35] <Tom_itx> how does that work?
[22:17:48] <Tom_itx> i mean, i know what you do with the dowel...
[22:17:53] <JT-Shop> I pass the values to the touchoff sub yes when I call it
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[22:17:57] <Tom_itx> the routine i'm talking about
[22:18:24] <JT-Shop> hmmm G10 something
[22:18:34] <jd896> Could I have the va
[22:19:34] <jd896> Feed in a box like we said then have an enter button that makes axis reload the nc file
[22:20:30] <JT-Shop> z touch off MDI_COMMAND = G10 L20 P1 Z0.375
[22:20:31] <jd896> That could then pass the entered feed to the sub when called could it not ?
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[22:29:54] <jd896> Ha
[22:30:00] <jd896> Woops
[22:30:41] <jd896> Can we hold this thought till morning Jt? Gotta get some sleep
[22:30:45] <jd896> Night all
[22:33:24] <JT-Shop> oknight
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[22:45:14] <Jymmm> What to google for so see an example (video?) of a mechanical directional change, much like a winder going back and fourth?
[22:46:11] <JT-Shop> fishing reel
[22:46:49] <Jymmm> TY!!!
[22:46:57] <JT-Shop> but that would be a good application for your stepper as you could change pitch with different rope diameters
[22:47:41] <Jymmm> JT-Shop: Hell, I might just buy some reels as is, KISS
[22:49:42] <Jymmm> JT-Shop: I'm still working on how to cut and start the winding of a new hank. I have an idea, but it requires a tube in a tube where one of the tubes not only rotates, but moves along it's linear axis as well. Much like a slide whistle
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[22:56:14] <Jymmm> I like the crown... http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=b-fqDz5ouyM&feature=related
[22:56:18] <JT-Shop> we cut mesh wire with one stationary tube and one moving tube with tight fit to shear off the wire
[22:57:07] <JT-Shop> we used a mixmaster to make deep see fishing reels on the rigs
[22:57:28] <Jymmm> JT-Shop: I was thinking something along those lines, with the "cut" operation initiated by a reversal of one of the tubes
[22:58:32] <Jymmm> I still need to fit in there of the clamp and cut so it can begin the next hank after the cut operation.
[22:59:33] <andypugh> Jymmm:
[22:59:34] <andypugh> http://youtu.be/3aobPgGzB-U
[23:01:09] <Jymmm> andypugh: interesting, seems simple enough. just have to figure out how to 1) tell it when it's at the end(s), and 2) it's speed of going back and forth.
[23:01:14] <Jymmm> andypugh: ty
[23:02:54] <Jymmm> http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=9qEhyQfbImY&feature=endscreen&NR=1
[23:03:00] <Jymmm> square hole
[23:04:29] <andypugh> Easier with CNC and spindle-synchronised motion :-)
[23:06:15] <Jymmm> http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=5ISj3Ad4vBU&NR=1&feature=fvwp
[23:06:31] <Jymmm> andypugh: =)
[23:07:56] <Jymmm> http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=guTSrF7J6Y0&feature=related
[23:09:47] <andypugh> Hmm, midnight. I should have made dinner earlier.
[23:10:00] <Tom_itx> make breakfast early
[23:10:23] <Jymmm> andypugh: Macho Beef burrito with extra cheese and sour cream =)
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[23:10:50] <andypugh> On the plus side, I have made the PWM to voltage board for my milling machine VFD
[23:11:00] <JT-Shop> cool!
[23:11:11] <Tom_itx> what cad package did you use?
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[23:20:32] <andypugh> Hmm?
[23:20:47] <andypugh> I used stripboard and surface-mount
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[23:22:11] <Tom_itx> oh
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[23:23:22] <andypugh> It's very simple once you realise that you need to use a totem-pole output opto
[23:23:25] <pfred1> andypugh did you see the box of junk I scored last weekend?
[23:23:35] <andypugh> Yes
[23:23:45] <PCW> I'm happy, I can now program totally blank 6I25 with a PCIE utility (something not possible with the 5I25)
[23:23:49] <pfred1> it had a piece of strip board in it
[23:24:14] <pfred1> nice shiny new and untouched
[23:24:49] <pfred1> it has some mystery etched board too
[23:25:30] <andypugh> Is the 6i25 on the market yet? I accidentally bought a PCIe motherboard.
[23:26:03] * JT-Shop wonders what to wipe the top of the anvil down with now that it is not rusty
[23:26:13] <pfred1> paste wax
[23:26:21] <PCW> Yep its available now
[23:26:29] <Tom_itx> any pics of it?
[23:26:32] <JT-Shop> ok
[23:26:36] * pfred1 likes Mothers
[23:26:44] <pfred1> though Johnsons is OK too
[23:26:46] <r00t4rd3d> perfert
[23:26:53] <r00t4rd3d> or pervert
[23:26:54] <JT-Shop> I have some Mothers tire black
[23:27:11] <pfred1> I fly cut my anvil
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[23:27:41] <pfred1> http://img26.imageshack.us/img26/1415/anvilspark.jpg
[23:27:58] <PCW> andypugh did you buy a DN2800?
[23:28:15] <pfred1> I did the horn with an angle grinder and flap wheels
[23:28:29] <pfred1> it wasn't as bad as I thought it'd be
[23:29:17] <andypugh> PCW Yes. I can't remeber why, but it seemed a good idea at the time.
[23:29:37] <PCW> it nice with its built in power supply
[23:30:05] <pfred1> I want to get into making switching PSUs
[23:30:16] <Tom_itx> how big?
[23:30:21] <pfred1> I read so much about them they're kind of exciting
[23:30:27] <PCW> and alexander had really good latency results
[23:31:04] <Jymmm> andypugh: you dont like the mobo?
[23:31:10] * JT-Shop went shopping in the automotive section of the garage but sadly found no paste wax
[23:31:32] <pfred1> in PC PSUs the 110-220 switch on the back takes a voltage doubler out of circuit
[23:31:44] <djdelorie> in our local hardware store, it's with floor cleaners
[23:31:48] <pfred1> JT-Shop I live in a swamp now so I'm constantly battling rust
[23:31:49] <Tom_itx> JT-Shop look for your old surfboard and the sexwax by it
[23:31:49] <PCW> Andy we shipped a 6I25 to you yesterday I think
[23:31:52] <JT-Shop> pfred1: nice
[23:32:04] <pfred1> paste wax is a god send
[23:32:08] <Jymmm> djdelorie: JT's garage
[23:32:22] <pfred1> thouth I clear coat lots of stuff too
[23:32:23] <Jymmm> djdelorie: JT's Commesary
[23:32:35] <djdelorie> yeah, but it's not in the automotive section of our hardware store. JT needs to look in the floor cleaner section of his garage...
[23:32:38] <JT-Shop> I use LPS 2 and 3 most of the time and 3 has some wax in it
[23:33:01] <pfred1> i wax my pliers
[23:33:03] * djdelorie uses Butcher's Bowling Alley Wax
[23:33:07] <pfred1> so they don't rust up on me
[23:33:10] <Jymmm> djdelorie: JT-Shop went shopping IN HIS GARAGE, in it's automotive section.
[23:33:23] <pfred1> I got tired of wire wheeling them all twice a year
[23:33:34] <djdelorie> I know. He needs to look IN HIS GARAGE, in the floor cleaner section. Wow, it's hard to get a joke in edgewise around here.
[23:33:40] <JT-Shop> I know I had a tub of it somewhere...
[23:34:06] <Jymmm> djdelorie: It doesn't exist, he never cleaners the floor! DUH!
[23:34:11] <Jymmm> cleans
[23:34:20] <JT-Shop> floor cleaner section only has mops, brooms, floor sweep and vacuum cleaners
[23:34:27] <pfred1> djdelorie http://www.instructables.com/id/Under-Shelf-Dual-Monitor-Support-Arms/
[23:34:40] <Jymmm> JT-Shop: and layers of cobwebs
[23:34:52] <pfred1> check out that mad woodworking!
[23:34:54] <Tom_itx> Jymmm, the can should be full then
[23:34:58] <JT-Shop> not many Jymmm
[23:35:25] <djdelorie> hmmm... I hadn't considered using wood for monitor supports. I always figured the last bits needed to be steel
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[23:35:49] <pfred1> I used oak from stair treads it might as well be steel
[23:35:56] <Jymmm> See all those toxic cleaners are bad for you... bobcat and a dumpster is the way yo clean the floors, desk, etc
[23:36:04] <djdelorie> oak is soft compared to some of the woods I've used
[23:36:18] <djdelorie> but red oak is my preferred wood anyway
[23:36:20] <pfred1> this was well seasoned
[23:36:27] <djdelorie> even so :-)
[23:36:29] <Jymmm> red oak? for what?
[23:36:33] <djdelorie> everything
[23:36:38] <Jymmm> ew
[23:36:41] <pfred1> oak checks too much
[23:36:44] <r00t4rd3d> i like oak too
[23:37:02] <pfred1> poor man's wood
[23:37:03] <Jymmm> I like oak too, but there are lots of others out there too
[23:37:15] <r00t4rd3d> like morning
[23:37:20] <djdelorie> http://www.delorie.com/wood/desk/photos/img_1986.html
[23:37:31] <pfred1> mahogany is nice
[23:37:38] <r00t4rd3d> yeah but expensive
[23:37:57] <r00t4rd3d> pine, now there some good stuff
[23:38:06] <pfred1> djdelorie mill that yourself?
[23:38:07] <Jymmm> for kindling
[23:38:19] <djdelorie> I buy it rough and dry, and do the finish milling myself
[23:38:30] <djdelorie> otherwise it's not flat enough
[23:38:31] <Jymmm> djdelorie: thats what she said
[23:38:41] <r00t4rd3d> Jymmm, or for building the house your currently living in.
[23:38:52] <pfred1> djdelorie http://i.imgur.com/QPZtB.jpg
[23:39:04] <pfred1> I cut that down myself
[23:39:19] <pfred1> we got awesome oak here
[23:39:24] <djdelorie> a little *too* rough for my taste, but cool anyway. I have a few small bits I milled myself, but nothing big
[23:40:00] <pfred1> yeah not my usual style I was channeling Nakashima
[23:40:26] <pfred1> to think in the 70s I could have bought his stuff for peanuts
[23:40:40] <pfred1> I used ot see him on the sidewalk in New Hope all the time
[23:41:52] <pfred1> he holds the worlds record today for a woodwork piece selling at auction
[23:43:32] <JT-Shop> gnipsel.com/shop/videos/IMG_0232.MOV
[23:43:40] <pfred1> http://www.skinnerinc.com/blog/2010/10/why-do-people-pay-so-much-for-nakashima-furniture.php
[23:44:47] <pfred1> JT-Shop I bet they don't misplace their paste wax
[23:46:01] <JT-Shop> lol, last time I remember it was two houses ago in LaPlace Louisiana
[23:46:42] <JT-Shop> but I'm working at better orginization now
[23:46:51] <djdelorie> did you check behind the couch?
[23:46:53] <pfred1> I don't think my house is worth what that table sold for
[23:46:56] <JT-Shop> crap my dad had a table that looked like that
[23:47:29] <pfred1> did it say George Nakashima on it?
[23:48:05] <pfred1> I think if they guy coughed in a napkin it's be worth thousands today
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[23:49:37] <JT-Shop> I have an oak tree that is about 4' across and burled from top to bottom
[23:49:50] <pfred1> get out the chainsaw!
[23:49:53] <JT-Shop> I hope it out lives me
[23:50:20] <Tom_itx> don't aim your cannon at it
[23:50:26] <JT-Shop> lol
[23:50:28] <Tom_itx> it may have a chance
[23:50:48] <pfred1> there is a house here with a cannonball in it
[23:51:04] <djdelorie> every time I mention my metal lathe to friends, they always ask if I've made a cannon yet.
[23:51:06] <pfred1> called the cannonball house of course
[23:51:10] <JT-Shop> a better shot gnipsel.com/shop/videos/IMG_0233.MOV
[23:52:54] <pfred1> make a miniture 88mm flak gun
[23:53:45] <andypugh> Well, while we are on "things we made out of wood" http://www.bodgesoc.org/Slaithwaite2/end_stairs.JPG
[23:53:48] <JT-Shop> I want to make a potato gun that looks like a WW2 Mortar
[23:54:09] <JT-Shop> nice Andy
[23:54:45] <Jymmm> http://v6.tinypic.com/player.swf?file=2zhk1h0
[23:55:02] <pfred1> andypugh that beam in the back looks a bit old
[23:55:05] <andypugh> stud walls take a lot longer when they are made out of oak and mortice and tennoned, you can see a bit of one top left.
[23:55:05] <JT-Shop> I stayed in a hotel in Amsterdam on the river that was a warehouse during the sailing days and had some huge timbers that made up the frame work
[23:55:12] <r00t4rd3d> JT-Shop, find a way to mortar an egg
[23:55:18] <r00t4rd3d> without breaking it
[23:55:34] <JT-Shop> trebuche
[23:55:40] <r00t4rd3d> lol
[23:55:41] <andypugh> pfred1: Yes, that second beam back might well be 400 years old.
[23:55:45] <pfred1> someone is using my street as a drag strip again
[23:56:00] <Jymmm> JT-Shop: There ya go, your own personalize cannon url... http://tinyurl.com/jtcannon
[23:56:01] <r00t4rd3d> GET OFF MY LAWN!
[23:56:27] <pfred1> r00t4rd3d they'd be little more than fertilizer by the time they hit my lawn
[23:56:42] <andypugh> I made the door and partition here too: http://www.bodgesoc.org/Slaithwaite2/Hall2.JPG
[23:57:07] <r00t4rd3d> house we just got done with : http://imgur.com/a/xmYiX
[23:57:15] <r00t4rd3d> roof trusses will be here in a couple weeks
[23:57:50] <pfred1> ah the woods aren't too thick at this angle http://img139.imageshack.us/img139/5026/p4110020.jpg
[23:58:06] <andypugh> I am going to guess that took less than 20 years, and will be warm and dry.
[23:58:24] <JT-Shop> dinner time and I'm the head chef today... so off I go
[23:58:36] <JT-Shop> good night
[23:58:45] <Jymmm> Cya groucho
[23:58:47] <r00t4rd3d> mac and cheese?
[23:58:59] <r00t4rd3d> w/ hotdogs
[23:59:07] <r00t4rd3d> and ketchup
[23:59:19] <pfred1> r00t4rd3d what did we all do before OSB?
[23:59:40] <Jymmm> with REAL processed imitation cheese food.
[23:59:45] <pfred1> r00t4rd3d out of season that stuff drops to $5.24 a sheet here!